Tsunami's Account Talk

I never heard of the Windfall Elimination Provision before. I looked it up, and found this: https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10045.pdf

If I'm reading the provision correctly, this doesn't affect those of us who are paying into Social Security, and always have?

Thanks, I'm feeling a little like Birchtree today, ended up over $40K on the day since I also have a huge QQQ calls trade going...and I held onto those anticipating good news from Facebook after hours....he shoots, he scores! I actually reached my retirement goal for cash today, so now I just have to get there for my TSP and I'd be ready to go if it wasn't for that dang Windfall Elimination Provision cutting my SS by 15% permanently if I was to retire now. I won't eliminate that cut in my social security until early 2019. Argh. I'm still holding out hope that Congress will pass H.R. 711 and eliminate that issue, but vacations and campaigning are more important to them.
 
I never heard of the Windfall Elimination Provision before. I looked it up, and found this: https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10045.pdf

If I'm reading the provision correctly, this doesn't affect those of us who are paying into Social Security, and always have?

weatherweenie.

The Windfall Elimination Provision (WEP) applies to CSRS employees/retiree's only. So if you are under the FERS system, it will not apply to you. Also, the CSRS employee/retiree must have had to work another job for 40 quarters (10 years) where social security was deducted from their pay. This qualifies them for the social security benefit, but at the reduced rate.

Hope this helps.
 
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Thanks for the clarification.

weatherweenie.

The Windfall Elimination Provision (WEP) applies to CSRS employees/retiree's only. So if you are under the FERS system, it will not apply to you. Also, the CSRS employee/retiree must have had to work another job for 40 quarters (10 years) where social security was deducted from their pay. This qualifies them for the social security benefit, but at the reduced rate.

Hope this helps.
 
I paid SSA for 18 years and they cut my SSA by 60%. Those with 20 years or greater are prorated, when you reach 30 years of paid SSA there is no penalty. Lucky me!!!!:sick:
 
I'm in the same boat Norm. I've been holding off filing for SS because there was a chance WEP might pass; but the politicians decided to screw that up for us at the last minute. So, it looks like we're back at square one until the amount of WEP can be agreed upon. NARFE has worked for a 50% penalty elimination for CSRS folks, but at the last minute some craphead wrote 14% into the bill and everything was tabled. My guess, nothing will happen. Oh well, the good news is my existing benefit just continues to go up.

FS
 
I'm in the same boat Norm. I've been holding off filing for SS because there was a chance WEP might pass; but the politicians decided to screw that up for us at the last minute. So, it looks like we're back at square one until the amount of WEP can be agreed upon. NARFE has worked for a 50% penalty elimination for CSRS folks, but at the last minute some craphead wrote 14% into the bill and everything was tabled. My guess, nothing will happen. Oh well, the good news is my existing benefit just continues to go up.

FS

I agree with you! When I signed on to work Civil Service the agreement was that If I qualified for SSA I could draw retirement from it and the CSRS they broke that contract when they INVENTED FERS to save money!
 
weatherweenie.

The Windfall Elimination Provision (WEP) applies to CSRS employees/retiree's only. So if you are under the FERS system, it will not apply to you. Also, the CSRS employee/retiree must have had to work another job for 40 quarters (10 years) where social security was deducted from their pay. This qualifies them for the social security benefit, but at the reduced rate.

Hope this helps.

Not true RF...I had about 8 years under CSRS, left the government for about 18 months, then came back in 1991...I had a choice of CSRS offset or FERS, chose FERS (which I've regretted ever since turning 55 last year)...So I'm FERS (or more formally "FERS with a CSRS component") and in my situation I fall under the WEP rules, and so I have to have 30 years of "substantial earnings" (currently $22,050, but it goes up with inflation) while paying SS taxes before the WEP no longer permanently cuts my SS (and my wife's too since she'll get half of mine). I will reach that point in early 2019 unless Congress changes the formula and kicks me out of this purgatory. So at this point I'm probably stuck working until early 2019 unless I decided that a 5% or 10% cut in my SS (and my wife's) is small enough to not matter. The cut is currently only $43/month (see weathweenie's link, it's 5% of $856) for each year I have under the 30 years...so if I retired now my SS would be cut 15% off the first part of the SS formula ($856)...or $128/month...if I hang on until next March then the cut drops to $86/month, then in March 2018 it will drop to just $43. I think by early 2018 I'll reach my TSP savings goal, so at that point I might decide to just take the 5% hit in SS for only having 29 years of "substantial earnings" and retire...I've got 3/31/18 on my calendar as the day.

This sideways grind in the S&P is maddening....but today's AAII sentiment survey results still show a very low percentage of bulls (31%), so I think it will break out higher soon.

http://www.aaii.com/sentimentsurvey/sent_results < very bullish!
 
"I'm in the same boat Norm. I've been holding off filing for SS because there was a chance WEP might pass; but the politicians decided to screw that up for us at the last minute. So, it looks like we're back at square one until the amount of WEP can be agreed upon. NARFE has worked for a 50% penalty elimination for CSRS folks, but at the last minute some craphead wrote 14% into the bill and everything was tabled. My guess, nothing will happen. Oh well, the good news is my existing benefit just continues to go up.

FS"

What actually happened was that the "rest of the public service folks" ie: State and County employee unions took exception to the idea that they should be covered by the WEP and talked to their congressional people about it and the elected representatives had to go back and revisit how they were going to consider voting on this WEP change.

WEP affects anyone who pays into Social Security and gets another kind of public pension.
 
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With 50% I would get around $250 a month and the wife's would go up around $115 a month, she gets 50% of what I get - a penalty for drawing it at 62. that would give me some MAD MONEY!!!
 
Instead of the pullback Gunner expected, we've just been getting sideways chop for two weeks. With a close above 2160 tomorrow I think we'll hit his 2215 target (and maybe higher) by next Friday, 8/5, then comes a small pullback back down to these levels later in August...then on up to 2350...then the new President gets greeted with a recession next year (just like Obama in '08).

17072016

Man, somebody get the defibrillator, looks like an irregular heartbeat the last 5 days...
http://finance.yahoo.com/chart/^GSPC?ltr=1 :worried:
 
If you hired on in this era or earlier and think your CSRS, better double check because some have found that they are "CSRS OFFSET" which I think but not sure is a catagory of its own. Good Luck!
 
Recession coming, but not quite yet....
https://www.thefelderreport.com/201...on-has-never-failed-to-trigger-a-bear-market/

I think I'm guilty of #33 right now, getting greedy and changing my QQQ target for a pile of Aug 5th calls I'm holding from $116 to $117...
https://medium.com/the-mission/50-t...-that-i-am-nearing-50-447ecf884ef0#.mg67sdsap

Looks like the S&P is finally breaking free of the what's been the longest sideways consolidation since at least 1970. 2200 by Friday?

Northman unplugs from Twitter. I'll miss his great (free) charts but am glad to see him doing well...
https://northmantrader.com/2016/07/31/unplugging/
 
On a long road trip...today will be Grand Teton NP...the next few days Yellowstone...then on up to Canada and beyond....

Just had to report that I'm kicking myself yet again from straying from my system. I chickened out and went to F on Thursday, one day ahead of what my system said to do, and lost out on a nice gain...argh. Oh well, really enjoying this long scenic road trip. Any time away from work is a good reminder I want to be retired ASAP.
 
don't forget about huckleberries. while passing through keep your eye out for handmade huckleberry craft food. mmmmm. sweet montana sugar.
 
If you hired on in this era or earlier and think your CSRS, better double check because some have found that they are "CSRS OFFSET" which I think but not sure is a catagory of its own. Good Luck!

Anyone who got rehired after 1984, and had 5 years prior service under CSRS, falls into the CSRS offset category. Couldn't keep CSRS in full.

I hired on permanent in 1986, never had a choice, stuck automatically in FERS, less than 5 years prior CSRS service, so I didn't fall into the Offset category. But because my prior temporary-hire GS-time (<5yrs total service) occurred prior to 1989, I was allowed to buy back that time, so that it would count timewise towards retirement and the FERS annuity. The payback amount was minimal monetarily since I paid it back over 10 years ago, but it gave me half-year additional time towards retirement, which means I can retire half a year earlier than otherwise. It was worth it for that reason alone.

The people who fall into the Offset category (I have a friend who did), may need to go to extra effort to get their retirement calculated correctly, and it may take extra time to get it fully straightened out, even after they retire. My CSRS-offset friend went for over a year trying to get her retirement fully straightened out, and didn't receive full retirement pay until it was. She had more than 5 years CSRS time in prior to 1984, resigned to take critical time in her family life to raise kids, then was rehired after 1984, but before 1989. Because she was rehired during the CSRS-FERS transition years (1984-1989), she got full credit for her prior CSRS service once she repaid the CSRS retirement monies she had previously pulled out when she resigned to raise kids. So for her, her retirement consists of 5+years CSRS-retirement pay, and then x years of FERS/SS pay beyond those CSRS pay credits.

There were never a lot of people who fell into that Offset situation, so many HR specialists had a hard time figuring out the right amount of retirement credits and correct retirement pay due. If anyone here is in the Offset-boat, pay close attention when HR runs your retirement math. they may get it wrong the first time around.
 
don't forget about huckleberries. while passing through keep your eye out for handmade huckleberry craft food. mmmmm. sweet montana sugar.

I made a point yesterday to take a longer route from SLC so that we could stop in Garden City, UT by Bear Lake and enjoy a yummy raspberry shake at Zips...and I got some raspberry jam. What a mob of people in Garden City though. I miss the 60s/70s, when we felt like we had the world to ourselves....after a few days at Yellowstone we're headed to Glacier NP, Calgary, Banff/Lake Louise, Jasper, Edmonton, Regina, Theodore Roosevelt NP, Mt. Rushmore....wife is packed, time to go...
 
Anyone who got rehired after 1984, and had 5 years prior service under CSRS, falls into the CSRS offset category. Couldn't keep CSRS in full.

I hired on permanent in 1986, never had a choice, stuck automatically in FERS, less than 5 years prior CSRS service, so I didn't fall into the Offset category. But because my prior temporary-hire GS-time (<5yrs total service) occurred prior to 1989, I was allowed to buy back that time, so that it would count timewise towards retirement and the FERS annuity. The payback amount was minimal monetarily since I paid it back over 10 years ago, but it gave me half-year additional time towards retirement, which means I can retire half a year earlier than otherwise. It was worth it for that reason alone.

The people who fall into the Offset category (I have a friend who did), may need to go to extra effort to get their retirement calculated correctly, and it may take extra time to get it fully straightened out, even after they retire. My CSRS-offset friend went for over a year trying to get her retirement fully straightened out, and didn't receive full retirement pay until it was. She had more than 5 years CSRS time in prior to 1984, resigned to take critical time in her family life to raise kids, then was rehired after 1984, but before 1989. Because she was rehired during the CSRS-FERS transition years (1984-1989), she got full credit for her prior CSRS service once she repaid the CSRS retirement monies she had previously pulled out when she resigned to raise kids. So for her, her retirement consists of 5+years CSRS-retirement pay, and then x years of FERS/SS pay beyond those CSRS pay credits.

There were never a lot of people who fell into that Offset situation, so many HR specialists had a hard time figuring out the right amount of retirement credits and correct retirement pay due. If anyone here is in the Offset-boat, pay close attention when HR runs your retirement math. they may get it wrong the first time around.

Including my sick leave I have almost 8 years CSRS time, and I bought back that time when I was rehired in 1991 (interest rates were so high in those days, it cost me over $20K to buy back that time)...I was rehired as CSRS offset, but had the choice of keeping that status or going to FERS. Basically the only difference (since CSRS Offset folks also pay into social security) was that I could have retired at 55 with CSRS Offset...probably would have been better in hindsight, but oh well, that's the choice I made...the stock market was doing well at the time and I figured I could do a bit better with the full TSP match and contributions. I do have the boost in my pension though with the CSRS component (and will get a slight boost in my COLA's too, if inflation every heats up)...so if I retire with 35 years, then adding in my one full year of sick leave that's split between the two components my pension, my total pension will be about 40% of my high-3. I've had HR run retirement estimates and they have the CSRS component in there correctly, all the paperwork is in my electronic folder including proof that I paid back my withdrawal for my CSRS years, so (knock on wood) I'm not worried about OPM getting it wrong.
 
I made a point yesterday to take a longer route from SLC so that we could stop in Garden City, UT by Bear Lake and enjoy a yummy raspberry shake at Zips...and I got some raspberry jam. What a mob of people in Garden City though. I miss the 60s/70s, when we felt like we had the world to ourselves....after a few days at Yellowstone we're headed to Glacier NP, Calgary, Banff/Lake Louise, Jasper, Edmonton, Regina, Theodore Roosevelt NP, Mt. Rushmore....wife is packed, time to go...

you're blowing through my old neighborhood there cuz. just a little west now. happy trails.
 
you're blowing through my old neighborhood there cuz. just a little west now. happy trails.

Well it's a beautiful neighborhood Burro. Had a yummy breakfast at the Bunnery in Jackson, picked up some huckleberry jam per your recommendation, spent a great day in Grand Teton NP, then headed on to West Yellowstone via far eastern Idaho...the wheat country there is remarkably similar to the Palouse Country of southeast Washington, really gorgeous.

I got some good video of these critters as well...

Grand Teton NP.jpg
 
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