ChemEng's Account talk...

[fabijo]

I think the type of "multiculturalism" that Birch is talking about is the one that tells everyone to think the same way. Multiculturalism is a word used to say there is openness, but in reality, it is very close-minded. It is not quite the same as cultural diversity. New York City is the most culturally diverse city that I know of and just moved out of.

The message to students about embracing all cultures sounds great on the surface. The message that is eventually given is, "There are many cultures and many religions. There is not just one way." Now, what just happened to all those cultures and religions? If the core of any religion says that there is only one way, that religion becomes wrong. Meaning, multiculturalism just annihilated a culture with it's "open-mindedness." Slowly, they are getting the kids to grow up to be "open-minded", but in the end they are all leaving their religion and culture, while becoming one mindset. In the long run, MULTIculturalism becomes UNIculture.

 

[Birchtree]

The difference is the founding fathers weren't forcing their views on everyone else. They were celebrating their differences - not trying to make everyone else the same. Again, today multiculturalism seeks to eliminate all standards and aspirations in order to reduce everyone and everything to the same level. In the school environment they don't encourage exceptional students to over achieve but rather remain bored so the other at risk students can maintain selfesteem. They don't want anyone to be better than the rest - but we are not all the same. You'll get your turn and I wish you luck for the benefit of your children. For all I know you yourself might be an affirmative action candidate - just like Michelle and Barack.

 

[fabijo]

You obviously don't have kids in public school yet - just wait. I suspect some of your liberal views will change as they experience dumbing down so the rest at risk can have favorable selfesteem. It starts around the sixth grade.

For some reason, many of the parents in New York City haven't changed their liberal views.

 

[fabijo]

The difference is the founding fathers weren't forcing their views on everyone else. They were celebrating their differences - not trying to make everyone else the same.

That's what I was talking about.

 

[Steadygain]

Again, today multiculturalism seeks to eliminate all standards and aspirations in order to reduce everyone and everything to the same level.

Well at one point I actually believed that as a Male - I was superior to all Females; as a White - superior to all other races. But I've grown up and honestly gotten to know how things really are.

Deep down we should be regarded as the same; the sanctinty of life; knowing that as new born babies we are priceless and deserving of a healthy productive life. Divisions and barriers should not be imposed on anyone because of their race or gender - but "genetics" with nurturing should challenge all those geared towards academic, techonological, musical advancements.

It is NOT "Multiculturalism" that seeks to destroy or reduce anyone; it is the prejudism - racism - and other destuctive elements at play.

In the school environment they don't encourage exceptional students to over achieve but rather remain bored so the other at risk students can maintain selfesteem.

We can't blame "Multiculturalism" for this - this is based on the Powers in charge forcing laws and rules that prohibit the intellectual growth that woud make the country a lot better.

Here I would join your fight - but we'd be dealing with powers far beyond Barclays. It is not "Blacks" or "Whites" to blame for this or any Nationality.

They don't want anyone to be better than the rest - but we are not all the same.

That's not what "THEY" want - they all want the same thing we do; to be given a fair chance to prove themselves and allowed to be pushed to and obtain their highest potiential. Again you have it all wrong. If everyone was allowed to do this - regardless of race or gender or nationality - think how much better off everyone would be. Let all those who can truly excell reach the sky.

You'll get your turn and I wish you luck for the benefit of your children. For all I know you yourself might be an affirmative action candidate - just like Michelle and Barack.

My children have far excelled above anything I could ever have strived to obtain. They are way beyond me.

 

[Aviator_Guy]

I want to point out that the public school systems are not failing the kids, the parents are.

I come from a long family of teachers. Today's teachers are smarter, and schools have more tools then ever before. The biggest problem is lack of parents participation and responcibility for their kids actions.

From my perspective, because this nation has moved away from conservative family values, we have sacrificed our kids future. Two income familys, single parents, and poverty contribute to the problems of out education system.

I agree with JTH, a good portion of the responsibility is with the parents. My wife and I managed to get our kids excited about education early in life and that is the key for developing their minds. I believe something as simple as reading to them and taking them to the various museums early in life is important. When you get them hooked on reading and wanting to explore anything new and exciting helps them to understand that education can actually be a lot of fun.

If you ask a lot of young kids today name your favorite book, most will give you a title or two. But if you ask them their favorite video game, they will rap off ten titles from their XBOX 360, PS3, Wii and oh yeah, their DS!! I think it’s time to turn off the video games and learn how to have fun with something that doesn’t require electrical power.

I have three kids, two boys and a girl. The girl is a full time college student. The oldest son is now out of the USAF and going to college full time. The youngest son is awaiting a security clearance to enter the FAA air traffic controller program. So, when I watch the gloom and doom on the DNC, I just don’t see the same things in my life. With a good attitude, hard work and a proper education, you can live whatever dream you desire!

 

[Birchtree]

We all as a society recognize where the problems are as a result of Donkey liberal policies. We have forced busing to achieve racial parity and the white middle class kids that can't escape by attending a private school end up paying a disproportionate price in both education and character. We have affirmative action to help a few chosen as apposed to fair competition. We have the issue of multiculturalism so that no one is encouraged to have more aspiration than his class mates. We have a welfare policy that encourages children out of wedlock - you don't get the money if you have a man in the house. The Donkey needs to be retired as many of his policies are being repudiated - Nobama. You know the silent majority is not going to take it any longer. We need more midnight basketball to harness the crime wave filling our prison beds or better build more orphanages to stem the tide of failures. God give us strength.

 

[ChemEng]

The difference is the founding fathers weren't forcing their views on everyone else.

I would say that the founding fathers forced their views on every American since. That is kind of the role the Constitution has on our country...

They were celebrating their differences - not trying to make everyone else the same.

You may want to refresh yourself on exactly what you are talking about. For example, the different positions pertaining to slavery werent celebrated during its discussion. There were many going into the debate--and 1 leaving. Likewise the topic of going to war with the British wasnt celebrated in its discussion. there were many various positions going into the debate--and 1 leaving. In fact I would saw the exact opposite of what you are claiming here is true. Seriously Birch, your knowledge of US history is astonishingly bad.

 

[ChemEng]

We all as a society recognize where the problems are as a result of Donkey liberal policies.

This time its the False Delimma Logical Fallacy. Just because there are problems with the policies of one side of the political coin doesnt mean the other side is automatically right.

You're 2 for 2 today. Keep it up!

 

[Steadygain]

So, when I watch the gloom and doom on the DNC, I just don’t see the same things in my life. With a good attitude, hard work and a proper education, you can live whatever dream you desire!

Amen!! My friend. We are very fortunate to have spouses that helped us instill the values by which our children not only developed dreams to achieve - but even went beyond them. A good home makes a world of difference.

 

[Birchtree]

My good man I wasn't discussing American history - I'm here and now not 200 years ago. I'm not elaborating on the 1964 civil rights bill or anything to deal with history. I will say that from an ideological standpoint that multiculturalism is but a thinly veiled attack on the central principles and ideas of Western civilization. These issues and principles have given us the greatest prosperity, the highest standard of living and, more important, the greatest individual freedom ever known to man. And whether or not you agree doesn't matter - we each protect our families in our own way and I can assure you your turn will eventually arrive - that's my only real point. Believe it or not.

 

[Steadygain]

Birch - you know I love you - despite some of your insane grumpy ways.

I'm afraid you're becoming like "Chicken Little" - your constant slams against the Dems; Obama... just go in one ear and out the other.

 

[ChemEng]

I will say that from an ideological standpoint that multiculturalism is but a thinly veiled attack on the central principles and ideas of Western civilization.

Im not debating American history either Birch. My point is simply that if what you above is true, then the founding fathers were also perpetrating the same "thinly veiled attacked" because they embraced the same same multicultural ideals that you are bashing.

 

[Birchtree]

OK, I've said my piece and can do no more. You're entitled to your views and can continue to do as you see best for the family. It's what makes America. I raised my daughter my way fighting against the lame Donkey policies and frankly would do it again as I'm sure she will when it comes her turn if necessary. We need four more years of the last eight to make real progress in this country.

 

[nnuut]

Don't stop, I love it!!!

 

[XL-entLady]

We need four more years of the last eight to make real progress in this country.

ROFL!!!! Ah, Birch, we love you anyway! We truly do!

By the way, did you hear what G.W. Bush got on his S.A.T.'s? Drool. :laugh: Kidding, kidding.

Thanks for the visit to your home, ChemEng, love what you've done with the place!

Lady

 

[ChemEng]

We need four more years of the last eight to make real progress in this country.

Wow. Im surprised you can sleep at night...

 

[Birchtree]

There is no need for radical change - the economy is not going into recession. I sleep fine because I'm secure in all aspects of my life. We need change in energy policy and further tax reduction and McCain will provide that. I won't beleaguer any other points because I don't have the time or the desire. And no I won't be watching Nobama tonight - he's a dead horse.

 

[nasa1974]

This was E-mailed to me and I thought it might fit into the thread that Birch started. However I could not verify the authenticity of this information. I did find it interesting none the less.


Subject: Former Colorado Governor

A long read but enlightening.....................

Wherever you stand, please take the time to read this; it ought to scare the pants off you!

We know Dick Lamm as the former Governor of Colorado. In that context his thoughts are particularly poignant. Last week there was an immigration overpopulation conference in Washington, DC , filled to capacity by many of America 's finest minds and leaders. A brilliant college professor by the name of Victor Hansen Davis talked about his latest book, 'Mexifornia,' explaining how immigration - both legal and illegal was destroying the entire state of California. He said it would march across the country until it destroyed all vestiges of The American Dream.

Moments later, former Colorado Governor Richard D Lamm stood up and gave a stunning speech on how to destroy America. The audience sat spellbound as he described eight methods for the destruction of the United States. He said, 'If you believe that America is too smug, too self-satisfied, too rich, then let's destroy America. It is not that hard to do. No nation in history has survived the ravages of time. Arnold Toynbee observed that all great civilizations rise and fall and that 'An autopsy of history would show that all great nations commit suicide.''

'Here is how they do it,' Lamm said: 'First, to destroy America, turn America into a bilingual or multi-lingual and bicultural country.' Hi story shows that no nation can survive the tension, conflict, and antagonism of two or more competing languages and cultures. It is a blessing for an individual to be bilingual; however, it is a curse for a society to be bilingual. The historical scholar, Seymour Lipset, put it this way: 'The histories of bilingual and bi-cultural societies that do not assimilate are histories of turmoil, tension, and tragedy.' Canada, Belgium, Malaysia, and Lebanon all face crises of national existence in which minorities press for autonomy, if not independence. Pakistan and Cyprus have divided. Nigeria suppressed an ethnic rebellion. France faces difficult times with Basques, Bretons, and Corsicans.'

Lamm went on: Second, to destroy America, 'Invent 'multiculturalism' and encourage immigrants to maintain their culture. Make it an article of belief that all cultures are equal. That there are no cultural differences. Make it an article of faith that the Black and Hispanic dropout rates are due solely to prejudice and discrimination by the majority. Every other explanation is out of bounds.

Third, to destroy America, 'We could make the United States an 'Hispanic Quebec 'without much effort. The key is to celebrate diversity rather than unity. As Benjamin Schwarz said in the Atlantic Monthly recently: 'The apparent success of our own multiethnic and multicultural experiment might have been achieved not by tolerance but by hegemony. Without the dominance that once dictated ethnocentricity and what it meant to be an American, we are left with only tolerance and pluralism to hold us together.' Lamm said, 'I would encourage all immigrants to keep their own language and culture. I would replace the melting pot metaphor with the salad bowl metaphor. It is important to ensure that we have various cultural subgroups living in America enforcing their differences rather than as Americans, emphasizing their similarities.'

'Fourth, to destroy America, I would make our fastest growing demographic group the least educated. I would add a second underclass, unassimilated, undereducated, and antagonistic to our population I would have this second underclass have a 50% dropout rate from high school.'

'My fifth point for destroying America would be to get big foundations and business to give these efforts lots of money. I would invest in ethnic identity, and I would establish the cult of 'Victimology.' I would get all minorities to think that their lack of success was the fault of the majority. I would start a grievance industry blaming all minority failure on the majority population.'

'My sixth plan for America's downfall would include dual citizenship, and promote divided loyalties. I would celebrate diversity over unity. I would stress differences rather than similarities. Diverse people worldwide are mostly engaged in hating each other- that is, when they are not killing each other. A diverse, peaceful, or stable society is against most historical precedent. People undervalue the unity it takes to keep a nation together. Look at the ancient Greeks. The Greeks believed that they belonged to the same race; they possessed a common Language and literature; and they worshipped the same gods. All Greece took part in the Olympic Games. A common enemy, Persia, threatened their liberty. Yet all these bonds were not strong enough to overcome two factors: local patriotism and geographical conditions that nurtured political divisions. Greece fell. 'E. Pluribus Unum' -- from many, one. In that historical reality, if we put the emphasis on the 'Pluribus' instead of the 'Unum,' we will balkanize America as surely as Kosovo.'

Also, to destroy America, I would place all subjects off limits; make it taboo to talk about anything against the cult of 'diversity.' I would find a word similar to 'heretic' in the 16th century - that stopped discussion and paralyzed thinking. Words like 'racist' or 'xenophobe' halt discussion and debate. Having made America a bilingual/bicultural country, having established multiculturalism, having the large foundations fund the doctrine of 'victimology,' I would next make it impossible to enforce our immigration laws. I would develop a mantra: That because immigration has been good for America, it must always be good. I would make every individual immigrant symmetric and ignore the cumulative impact of millions of them.'

In the last minute of his speech, Governor Lamm wiped his brow. Profound silence followed. Finally he said, 'Lastly, I would censor Victor Hanson Davis's book 'Mexifornia.' His book is dangerous. It exposes the plan to destroy America. If you feel America deserves to be destroyed, don't read that book.'

There was no applause. A chilling fear quietly rose like an ominous cloud above every attendee at the conference. Every American in that room knew that everything Lamm enumerated was proceeding methodically, quietly, darkly, yet pervasively across the United States today. Discussion is being suppressed. Over 100 languages are ripping the foundation of our educational system and national cohesiveness. Even barbaric cultures that practice female genital mutilation are growing as we celebrate 'diversity.' American jobs are vanishing into the Third World as corporations create a Third World in America - take note of California and other states - to date, ten million illegal aliens and growing fast. It is reminiscent of George Orwell's book '1984.' In that story, three slogans are engraved in the Ministry of Truth building: 'War is peace,' 'Freedom is slavery,' and 'Ignorance is strength.'

Governor Lamm walked back to his seat. It dawned on everyone at the conference that our nation and the future of this great democracy is deeply in trouble and worsening fast. If we don't get this immigration monster stopped within three years, it will rage like a California wildfire and destroy everything in its path especially The American Dream.




May the force be with us.

 

[alevin]

There is one major difference between the south of the border illegals, and the historic sources of immigrants. We share a common border and a history of conflict with the ones coming up from the south. My ancestors came from Germany, Ireland, Scotland, England-very early-to the east coast and inland. the immigrants from the south are still being taught in their schools that we "stole" the northern part of "their" country and they still want it back. History of N. Ireland goes back centuries too. How long did it take them to find some segregated peace? Yes, they still don't go into each other's neighborhoods or mingle socially even now-I learned that earlier this year. It's safer for everyone who lives there to live that way and it may go on that way indefinitely. Families and societies have long memories even if individuals don't. I'd be inclined to migrate myself if we deteriorate too far, only I don't know if North Dakota would let me in-or if it'd be any better there. Sorry, I had to lighten up a little.