What YOU can do to fight back - IFT limit

The 2006 contractor study of the TSP funds said this:

"The costs of administering the TSP’s investment options are well below industry average at less than 0.05%. Investment fees for most other plans range from 0.50% to 0.80%. We rarely observe total investment fees below 0.45% for participant defined contribution plans."

So what is their problem? Leave the limits as they are!
 
L FUNDS vs. I FUND COSTS?

Does anyone know the mothly or daily costs of TSP reblancing all the L Funds vs. the I fund? Would be very interesting to know!
 
This is a portion of what they submitted on Sep 7th, 2007 With a cut off date of Sep 21st, 2007 for comments. (2 weeks for comments)



SUMMARY: The Federal Retirement Thrift Investment Board (Agency) is
amending its regulations to reflect the Agency's use of account numbers
in place of Social Security numbers as the primary way of identifying
participants' TSP accounts as well as the replacement of the Personal
Identification Numbers (PINs) with passwords to enter the Account
Access portion of the TSP Web site. These changes represent enhanced
security measures for the TSP.

DATES: This rule is effective October 1, 2007, without further action,
unless adverse comment is received by September 21, 2007. If adverse
comment is received, the Agency will publish a timely withdrawal of the
rule in the Federal Register.

ADDRESSES: Comments may be sent to Thomas K. Emswiler, General Counsel,
Federal Retirement Thrift Investment Board, 1250 H Street, NW.,
Washington, DC 20005. The Agency's Fax number is (202) 942-1676.

FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT: Megan Graziano on (202) 942-1660.
 
Stoplight - I went to the www.regulations.gov website and attempted to set up an e-mail notification for any proposed rule postings by FRTIB....but was unable to figure out how to do it. When you click on "e-mail notifications", it takes you to a narrative that explains what that means, but no instructions on how to actually set it up!! Can you help? I think it is very important that many of us get set up for this, so that we know as soon as FRTIB posts something related to the IFT restriction proposed rule. Thanks.

RAE,

Sorry....I guess it's a case of me posting my note before I actually checked out how to do it, and did it myself ! :confused:

I see what you're saying....see below !

I registered for some type of notification - not sure though because it isn't clear whether I've registered for all pertinent FRTIB notifications or just the one I clicked on.

I went to: http://www.regulations.gov

Next, I did a search for FRTIB

Next, I found the little icon that looks like an envelope.

Next, I clicked on the envelope icon and got a screen requesting my email and which type of notices I wanted. I clicked all of them (referring to FRTIB).

Now the real confusion lies in the fact that there is a little envelope icon by every single event such as "sunshine act" (which I don't care about). I found an entry for "Meetings: Employee Thrift Advisory Council " even though it was dated for 2006 and clicked on the "envelope Icon" close by. Then filled in the form and checked all boxes and clicked on "submit".

My intuition tells me that because I check all boxes, that will cover everything and not just the initial box for "meetings" that I clicked but there is no guarantee that this is remotely like an intuitive process.

Got a notice on the screen that I would be emailed something in order to complete my registration. That was 15 minutes ago and I haven't been emailed anything yet so this isn't an "instantaneous" process. I'll post if I get something.



Ayla,

Thanks for the note on what you did....I followed along through your steps, and I think I see what's happening....

It appears that the web site's "email notification" is for when you want to be notified, by email, when anything new is posted to a SPECIFIC DOCKET NUMBER. BUT....each "action" by the FRTIB will probably have a different docket number, so this won't work for what we need !

I THINK what we need to sign up for, is the "RSS Feed", but I'm old and gray, and I'm not sure how to do this :) ! I'll post a "help" request in another forum, and see if some of these young, computer-literate folks here on the MB can help us out :D I suspect it means, though, that we MAY have to wade through every agency's postings, until we see the one we want ! Once the FRTIB's announcement is out, and a specific docket number is established, then we can use the "email notification" feature to keep up to date.....make sense ????

Stoplight...
 
Art2007,

Great post ! As I noted, it's a political process, and you've given us good concrete names to target, as well as our local reps !

....oh, and by the way.....welcome to the Board :D !

Stoplight...
 
thanks stoplight if you see us going the wrong way feel free to jump in or continue to investigate the problen we are having with the thrift board. again thanks

Thanks for the kind words, pogo ! I'm certainly NOT someone to provide advice to "us" on which way to go with this ! All I can do is provide my experience to the discussion, and collectively, we do what we think needs to be done :)

The beauty of this MB is that we DO have many folks with a wealth of knowledge, in a ton of different areas, from many different agencies....AND they are willing to share with the rest of us ! I'm just happy to kick in what little I can !

Stoplight...
 
There is a 60 day comment period and we need to flood them with comments during that time. No waiting until the last minute. Details will come out in the Annual Statement for TSP.


Show-me: Not sure where you got the info that it'll be a 60 day comment period.....in my experience, it can be 30....it can be 90....or whatever the Agency decides ! It's like a personnel vacancy announcement where the Agency already has someone picked....they advertise it for the bare minimum, and hope nobody with a "veteran's preference" applies :mad:

Also, "flood them with comments" can be easily addressed if the "flood" all says the same thing (see my other post !)

Thanks for the work you do !

Stoplight...
 
I registered for some type of notification - not sure though because it isn't clear whether I've registered for all pertinent FRTIB notifications or just the one I clicked on.

I went to: http://www.regulations.gov

Next, I did a search for FRTIB

Next, I found the little icon that looks like an envelope.

Next, I clicked on the envelope icon and got a screen requesting my email and which type of notices I wanted. I clicked all of them (referring to FRTIB).

Now the real confusion lies in the fact that there is a little envelope icon by every single event such as "sunshine act" (which I don't care about). I found an entry for "Meetings: Employee Thrift Advisory Council " even though it was dated for 2006 and clicked on the "envelope Icon" close by. Then filled in the form and checked all boxes and clicked on "submit".

My intuition tells me that because I check all boxes, that will cover everything and not just the initial box for "meetings" that I clicked but there is no guarantee that this is remotely like an intuitive process.

Got a notice on the screen that I would be emailed something in order to complete my registration. That was 15 minutes ago and I haven't been emailed anything yet so this isn't an "instantaneous" process. I'll post if I get something.

tinyrul:
http://tinyurl.com/yt97on

Url with embedded carriage return in case the tiny URL above expires:

http://www.regulations.gov/
fdmspublic/component/main?main=Notification&d=FRTIB-2006-000
 
WV-Girl, Miss Piggy, and all,


For a good basic review of the rule making process, as well as current and past rule making, there is a good gov’t site here : www.regulations.gov Check out the FAQ under "How to Use This Site" for basic info on the process, etc.


The Good News

The web site noted above has an alert notification one can sign up for, so we should be able to find out when the FRTIB posts their proposal (assuming they use the site this time !) Also, comments to the docket can be submitted on-line, making it easier for us to submit our concerns.


Stoplight...

Stoplight - I went to the www.regulations.gov website and attempted to set up an e-mail notification for any proposed rule postings by FRTIB....but was unable to figure out how to do it. When you click on "e-mail notifications", it takes you to a narrative that explains what that means, but no instructions on how to actually set it up!! Can you help? I think it is very important that many of us get set up for this, so that we know as soon as FRTIB posts something related to the IFT restriction proposed rule. Thanks.
 
What we can do to fight back:

1. You can take the last newsletter (very informative) at www.tspshareholder.org and send it to every federal employee you know.

2. We need to write our Senators and Congressmen, but ESPECIALLY the ones on the following committees that have direct oversight on TSP:

a. Senate Subcommittee on Oversight of Government Management, the Federal Workforce, and the District of Columbia

b. House Subcommittee on Federal Workforce, Postal Service, and the District of Columbia

The members for the Senate Subcommitte are: Daniel K. Akaka Chairman (D-HI) George V. Voinovich Ranking Member (R-OH) Carl Levin (D-MI) Ted Stevens (R-AK) Thomas R. Carper (D-DE) Tom Coburn (R-OK) Mark L. Pryor (D-AR) John Warner (R-VA) Mary L. Landrieu (D-LA)

The members of the House Subcommittee are: Danny K. Davis, Chairman, Eleanor Holmes Norton, John P. Sarbanes, Elijah E. Cummings, Dennis J.Kucinich, Wm. Lacy Clay, Stephen F. Lynch, Kenny Marchant, John M. McHugh John L. Mica, Darrell E. Issa, Jim Jordan

The Senate members all accept email from anyone. The House members only accept email from the zip codes they serve. But a short letter with a copy of the most recent newsletter attached would be very helpful.

 
thanks stoplight if you see us going the wrong way feel free to jump in or continue to investigate the problen we are having with the thrift board. again thanks
 
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Thanks for the info(I think). But the real question remains.. does the public suggestions/comments acutally affect the pr outcom? At the very least can it be delayed? Do they really consider our opinions before rubber stamping it? Has there ever been a case where there was such major opposition that a pr was actually dropped?

WV-Girl, Miss Piggy, and all,

Having been involved in some Agency rule-making in the past, I may have something to contribute here (cause it’s certainly not my investing prowess ! :))

First, my disclaimers :
1. I’ve only been involved on the fringes, usually from just the technical side....never been deeply involved by being one of the "inside the Beltway"-types.

2. Every Agency does things a little different....my experience may not match how the Board does their rule making.

Anyway, here are my comments :

For a good basic review of the rule making process, as well as current and past rule making, there is a good gov’t site here : www.regulations.gov Check out the FAQ under "How to Use This Site" for basic info on the process, etc.

It’s not mandatory that an Agency use this site, but many do....I see the FRTIB (Federal Retirement Thrift Investment Board) DOES have many items posted...you can do a search on "FRTIB" to see ‘em

The Bad News :

Although every comment should be addressed, very rarely (if ever !) do individual comments to the docket carry much weight. Usually, all the comments that come in and raise the same issue on the proposal are lumped together, and addressed with one response....volume/number of responses making a point doesn’t seem to matter. That one response is usually targeted to support the rule making’s conclusion...which makes sense (if you think about it objectively), since the "goal" is to refute the point, not address the number of responses !

Lawyers control the process (surprise, surprise !) The "wordsmithing" is unbelievable !

The Good News

The web site noted above has an alert notification one can sign up for, so we should be able to find out when the FRTIB posts their proposal (assuming they use the site this time !) Also, comments to the docket can be submitted on-line, making it easier for us to submit our concerns.

A typical rule making affects an Agency’s area of operation, and thus generate a relatively small number of responses.....since the changes by the FRTIB affect ALL Fed employees, and retirees, I can see a boatload of comments to the docket coming in (BUT....see above !)

In my experience, comments from organizations (like the ETAC, unions, etc) have more impact than individual comments.

All rule-making that I’ve been involved with has had to go through OMB for "approval" or sign off...that may be another avenue to make us heard, by contacting OMB...just a guess, though.


This is a political process ! The FRTIB is a "political" body... IMHO, one question from a Congress member (House or Senate) is worth way more than either an individual comment OR an organizational comment ! The point being....while it’s great to contact the FRTIB or the reps on the ETAC, you might also consider contacting your elected rep to Congress....particularly in those areas that have a large number of Fed employees, like Maryland and Virginia (and who seem to be particularly sensitive when they start dorking around with Fed employees !) Also, when the head of an Agency is a political appointee, and they are questioned by Congress, they become much more sensitive to which way the political wind is blowing....and may "sit" on the rule-making until the crap blows over, or kill it altogether....

Anyway, I hope this helps.....

Stoplight...
 
There is a 60 day comment period and we need to flood them with comments during that time. No waiting until the last minute. Details will come out in the Annual Statement for TSP.
 
Not to suggest it is all an easy process to understand but check this site for a beginning understanding. Basically when the TSP Board decides what course of action they want to take they will publish it as a Proposed Rule (PR) and those affected will have time to submit their comments/criticisms before the PR is adopted as a Final Rule (FR).

How can the public participate in rulemaking?
Citizens have a right to express their views before an agency adopts final rules Each Federal Register document tells you:
  • Whether comments are requested
  • How, when and where to comment
Writing effective comments?
  • Type neatly and cite rulemaking by docket number and other identifying information (subject heading; FR cite)
  • Include your name and address
  • Follow directions—agency may ask you to respond to specific questions or label comments with CFR parts or section numbers
  • Explain why you agree or disagree; suggest alternatives and substitute language for your requested changes
Thanks for the info(I think). But the real question remains.. does the public suggestions/comments acutally affect the pr outcom? At the very least can it be delayed? Do they really consider our opinions before rubber stamping it? Has there ever been a case where there was such major opposition that a pr was actually dropped?
 
Please 'splain the procedure of the Federal Register? Am I to understand that ONLY comments can be made? What good does that do? Seems that by the time it is published it will be too late?
tia
Not to suggest it is all an easy process to understand but check this site for a beginning understanding. Basically when the TSP Board decides what course of action they want to take they will publish it as a Proposed Rule (PR) and those affected will have time to submit their comments/criticisms before the PR is adopted as a Final Rule (FR).

How can the public participate in rulemaking?
Citizens have a right to express their views before an agency adopts final rules Each Federal Register document tells you:
  • Whether comments are requested
  • How, when and where to comment
Writing effective comments?
  • Type neatly and cite rulemaking by docket number and other identifying information (subject heading; FR cite)
  • Include your name and address
  • Follow directions—agency may ask you to respond to specific questions or label comments with CFR parts or section numbers
  • Explain why you agree or disagree; suggest alternatives and substitute language for your requested changes
 
Here's another response that I received from a different ETAC member:

The outcome and final regulations as to the changes being proposed by the TSP Board have not come to a conclusion as you indicate. Mr. Long was asked to prepare the language to be submitted to the Federal Register and provide it to the ETAC for comment and recommended changes. There was no motion or action taken by the ETAC at our meeting yesterday.

I have taken time to review all e-mails I have received on this issue including yours. It is my duty to represent all of the members of the TSP of which there are close to four million. I respect your right to speak out but I also feel that your interpretation of yesterday's meeting is incorrect. Several board members have exchanged ideas and options since yesterday's meeting. While we will have an opportunity to revise the proposal being made the public will also have a comment period when filed on the Federal Register.

Yesterday we received a lot of data and we heard a lot of options. I will continue to examine all the data I receive and in the end I will support what I think will be the best solution for every TSP member.

Have a great Christmas season and New Year! And please understand that it is my duty to represent to the best of my ability with the information I obtain to make a good decision for all TSP members.

Please 'splain the procedure of the Federal Register? Am I to understand that ONLY comments can be made? What good does that do? Seems that by the time it is published it will be too late?
tia
 
Here's another response that I received from a different ETAC member:

The outcome and final regulations as to the changes being proposed by the TSP Board have not come to a conclusion as you indicate. Mr. Long was asked to prepare the language to be submitted to the Federal Register and provide it to the ETAC for comment and recommended changes. There was no motion or action taken by the ETAC at our meeting yesterday.

I have taken time to review all e-mails I have received on this issue including yours. It is my duty to represent all of the members of the TSP of which there are close to four million. I respect your right to speak out but I also feel that your interpretation of yesterday's meeting is incorrect. Several board members have exchanged ideas and options since yesterday's meeting. While we will have an opportunity to revise the proposal being made the public will also have a comment period when filed on the Federal Register.

Yesterday we received a lot of data and we heard a lot of options. I will continue to examine all the data I receive and in the end I will support what I think will be the best solution for every TSP member.

Have a great Christmas season and New Year! And please understand that it is my duty to represent to the best of my ability with the information I obtain to make a good decision for all TSP members.
i would love to see the information that he gets from the thrift board. is there a way to get that infromation in a reasonable amount of time
 
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