RealMoneyIssues' Account Talk

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So, thought I would grab some long play TNA this morning and see if I can offset my very underwater TZA...

Well... Guess I was keeping my stops too close or the market doesn't like me (you pick).

I had just moved my stop to 45.10 at about 2:10pm because I thought there was some support there... The market burned me 15 minutes later...

My goal was 45.60 and would sell then since I am pretty sure the market is going to sell off this afternoon.

View attachment 15351

Gotta love it...
 
Wow, market is going up while POTUS has his scolding of the GOP...

Interesting. Maybe this is just part of a bear flag this morning and it will soon... die... off...
 
RealMoneyIssues said:
So, thought I would grab some long play TNA this morning and see if I can offset my very underwater TZA...
Click to expand...

RMI, a couple of thoughts on this kind of positioning. I did something like that in late July/early August and have lived to regret it. I understand the sentiment, in theory, but the reality is that you can hedge just as much by liquidating a given position. All the while you've got dry powder to use as you see fit.

I'm sure you've thought it through but recall that IF we continue to go down you MAY end up back in black on that TZA position...but IF you haven't sold off the TNA position it's all for naught.

That said IF we get enough volatility (certainly have plenty of that these days :D) you COULD make nice black exits on both positions...of course that is the hope. By mulling over my own experience I can see this working in a high volatility environment if the two positions aren't very far apart and you don't know which way the market is heading. For example: one day, mid channel, you buy TNA and TZA. Subsequently we go up for 3 days (sell TNA) then go down for a few days (sell TZA). Of course the sell orders need to be timed well AND you would do "better" if you had simply positioned correctly by buying only TNA selling after three days and buying TZA for the following days. I know, easier said than done.

Using my example: Had I liquidated my late July TNA position rather than try "hedging" with an inverse TZA positions I would have seen much less loss and even a handsome gain by having more capital available for subsequent, better timed moves. You see rather than sell TNA low I held TNA high AND acquired TZA high, now to make good I need to see both get high again!!! We're volatile but not that volatile!! In the mean time all of my subsequent ETF trades have been smaller positions (due to limited dry powder) in an effort to lower the cost basis of those long-term positions....so I'm trying to run back to the proverbial zero line with one hand tied behind my back. One of these days I'm going to heed my own advice :nuts: (again, easier said than done) and liquidate those long term positions BUT the recent up-down oscillations keep coming tantalizing close to my long-term cost basis so I (foolishly, in my opinion) keep holding out.

Obviously that is just one example but I thought it prudent to share. GL with the trade.
 
Guys, I'm glad I won't have to do your taxes. The IRS is watching every move you make via the infamous 1099 that your market maker is obliged to send them.
 
Birchtree said:
Guys, I'm glad I won't have to do your taxes. The IRS is watching every move you make via the infamous 1099 that your market maker is obliged to send them.
Click to expand...

And mine will be exceptionally impressive this year because I changed brokerage houses and consolidated a number of separate retirement accounts. I'll be starting on them early...to be honest I've already started.
 
Birchtree said:
Guys, I'm glad I won't have to do your taxes. The IRS is watching every move you make via the infamous 1099 that your market maker is obliged to send them.
Click to expand...

Honestly, provided I keep track of everything throughout the year, my taxes usually take about 1-3hrs including a 1099, it's not that big of deal. I'm also happy using ETFs because it means I spend A LOT less time researching individual companies and trying to sort through all their relevant baggage. Sure I've done more buying and selling this year but even if I have to fill out a multi-page 1099 I'm going to be way ahead of the game when it comes to time invested.
 
Mapper, I was able to break even on my TZA trade at the close yesterday. No gains, but no losses either... I was sweating bullets...

Waiting to see what Big Ben does today before I do anything, but I suspect I will be getting into TZA again later today :D
 
Well if you're happy breaking even you might consider cash ;)

I'm sticking w/ TZA for the short term since I got this position @ 42.64. I could lock in a gain right now but I think we've got some drop left. Although one of these days the big players are going to give us a pop after a BB speech, because now we all expect a drop!!!

I expect a lot of volatility today so I'm going to TRY sitting on my hands!! Been working for me since my last entry. Unfortunately my long term TZA position, that I wish I had not bought in early July has a cost basis of $52.25. I don't think I'll get back to even on this particular trade, but hoping to get close enough that I can finally justify a full liquidation of that LT position for a modest loss (i should have considered cash too :rolleyes:). THEN, I'll have more dry powder for the next round!!!
 
Mapper said:
Well if you're happy breaking even you might consider cash ;)

I'm sticking w/ TZA for the short term since I got this position @ 42.64. I could lock in a gain right now but I think we've got some drop left. Although one of these days the big players are going to give us a pop after a BB speech, because now we all expect a drop!!!

I expect a lot of volatility today so I'm going to TRY sitting on my hands!! Been working for me since my last entry. Unfortunately my long term TZA position, that I wish I had not bought in early July has a cost basis of $52.25. I don't think I'll get back to even on this particular trade, but hoping to get close enough that I can finally justify a full liquidation of that LT position for a modest loss (i should have considered cash too :rolleyes:). THEN, I'll have more dry powder for the next round!!!
Click to expand...
I had a TZA postition at $49.13, but offset it with one at $40.67; with all said and done, selling at $44.60 had me even so I am good. I now have everything to play with after Big Ben does his magic, either way the market goes...
 
did you grab any more?

I almost sold @46! I was short term bearish but never thought I'd be creeping so close to my break even point today!! Now It's just a question of what tomorrow brings...and I think I'm going to keep riding this bet through the close.
 
Mapper said:
did you grab any more?

I almost sold @46! I was short term bearish but never thought I'd be creeping so close to my break even point today!! Now It's just a question of what tomorrow brings...and I think I'm going to keep riding this bet through the close.
Click to expand...
No, but I am thinking about it here at 48.5

Just didn't have any direction to know which way it was going and I am so tired of being on the wrong side of a trade...
 
Too bad I was too chicken to be in the market with a steady decline and a potential nearly 11% gain... lost...

Sigh, maybe we will continue down and I can ride this a little way down and just have lost todays $$ :(
 
Well if it makes you feel any better I got chicken too and sold at the last minute @ 49.46. With a 16% run on this one short move I didn't want to get too greedy.

Still didn't break even on my long-term position but I did sell some of it off. So I'm left holding just a small chunk of TZA which will help if the slide continues
 
Mapper said:
Well if it makes you feel any better I got chicken too and sold at the last minute @ 49.46. With a 16% run on this one short move I didn't want to get too greedy.

Still didn't break even on my long-term position but I did sell some of it off. So I'm left holding just a small chunk of TZA which will help if the slide continues
Click to expand...

Yeah, if I would have not been chicken and held to closing today, I would be even on my 49.13 TZA from 2 weeks ago, and up a lot from my 40.67 TZA from Monday...

oh well :D

Lets see how tomorrow goes, looks 50:50 for an up to even day vs another down day
 
Hmmm, looking like a good day to be short... Let's see if it is just a gap down open and then recovery.

Not sure the bulls have the cojones, but who knows.

If SPY heads below 110 or so, I may buy some longs. Keeping my shorts as any rally will probably be short-lived as the overall goal is SPY of around 100.

If SPY heads above 117, I may add to my shorts. If the market regains this level, I really think that is the extent of the bulls strength and it will die there...

Just my thoughts ;)
 
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