Our Peoples Congress at Work

[Guest]

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Hey Spaf we both said we would stay away today - what is the deal??

Interesting market.

Bottom line: Society breaks down when you do not take care of our senior citizens and people with health emergencies.

You start chucking people out on the street it is going to turn into Escape from New York. Crime will a everyday part of life. For every action there is a reaction. The reaction is life will be worse for all...however the banks bottom lines are going to look great. But your state and fed taxes will have to go up for public safety increases that will be needed to protect you. Captilism is like cancer - it eats the host.

 

[Guest]

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Dr_Dubious wrote:

Captilism is like cancer - it eats the host.

Doctor D,

Would explain your use of the chinese flag as your avatar?

Thanks

 

[Guest]

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I have been inseminiated....

Read the news and comprehen it.

The bankrupcty change is a reflection our society as we know it is coming to an end. Chaos theory. All Empires near their end chuck their old, sick and frail to the curb. The pattern continues....

Also want something to help me with the transistional period for documentational purpose :s.

 

[Rolo]

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Mike wrote:

People should not be exempted. Just because you're old or have high medical bills or take care of someone does not grant you the right to screw over your creditors and not repay your debts.

There's no such thing as a free lunch. If people can back out of their debt obligations and run for cover, the creditors will make up the gap some other way. In other words, they will get their money out of the rest of us who follow the rules.

The long-term solution to this is to educate the public (read: the irresponsible) on how to manage money and debt.

BINGO!

greg wrote:

the Credit Card corporations are marketing to people who have not been educated just so they can take advantage of them. The CC corporations are destroying lives (and being irresponsible). Do you not care about anyone other than yourself?

That is assessing blame. Wrong answer. I only care for those who do not blame others for their own problems. We make our own beds. Wherever you are, you made an appointment to be there.

Dr_Dubious wrote:

He is part of generation I.

Mike is generation I? for saying that people should be responsible for themselves? Waitaminute...you mean the people who irresponsibly jammed themselves up with credit card debt to "enjoy life now" aren't the "I" generation?

Dr_Dubious wrote:

When I did financial planning I would ask people of his age about care for their parents. 95% of the time I would get - they can fend for themselves.

Our parents are supposed to know better...if they haven't figured it out by now, they never will, and they never listen 'cos they know better. If a parent plans on their child to financially support them...well, now who is the "I" generation?

Dr_Dubious wrote:

I have deemed them Generation I.

No you haven't, you arrogant dunce, that saying has been around for a while.

 

[Guest]

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Rolo wrote:

you arrogant dunce

Action/Reaction.

Good luck when crime rates go up double digits quarter after quarter.

Bank bottom lines will look great. That really help US.

:? Watch it with the personal attacks also. They are not warranted, needed or appreciated.

Obviously you have studied history and realize what happens when you start throwing people out on the streets. Yes, it is a pretty picture to corporate bottom lines - longer term you will have martial law. But what do I know...this has never happened before.

Bottom line: Your quality of life will SUCK wind and your taxes will go through the roof. That is what will happen. I would support that too...if I was a moron. Now go play your nintendo and leave the grown ups alone .

 

[Guest]

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Passed today:

By 59-40 tally, the Senate defeated a Democratic proposal to require that credit card statements show how long it would take the consumer to pay off his or her debt by making only the minimum monthly payment, and what the total interest charges would be.


Wonder why? Maybe they would stop charging stuff perhaps? Can not have that!

 

[Guest]

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The Comptroller General of the United States, David Walker, says bluntly that "the United States of America's public finances are a shambles". And "they're getting rapidly worse". America has a $43 trillion (including unfunded liabilities) problem. With GDP approaching $11trillion that is almost a Debt/GDP ratio of 4 to 1. Even at the height of the Great Depression it only reached 2.5 to 1. America is addicted to debt. But its very survivability and the financial survivability of the world is dependent on this not turning into a problem.

Ahh, Houston We All Ready Have a Problem. No reversing this badboy now. The daily interest on the debt is HUGE ($5.6B). So what do you do? Submit a budget that is $627B in the red. 1.827T if you include the cost to establish private accounts. Hmm doing the math - THAT WILL WORK :i. If the plan is to spend our way out of this problem - oh but 70% of the money is going off shore. Draughts...on second thought. Inseminate me now and get it over with...this slow death stuff is too painful.

 

[Rolo]

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Dr_Dubious wrote:

Good luck when crime rates go up double digits quarter after quarter.

Fine. Let the immoral kill each other. I live in a nice neighbourhood.

Dr_Dubious wrote:

Bank bottom lines will look great. That really help US.

Yes, it does, since my investments are in business, the whole point of the American free-economy. (key patriotic music here)

Dr_Dubious wrote:

:? Watch it with the personal attacks also. They are not warranted, needed or appreciated.

Now go play your nintendo and leave the grown ups alone .

Do as I say, not as I do? And you wonder why we don't care about old people anymore... :?

BTW, you started it, with Mike, but he's a nice guy and doesn't stoop to that level, but, I, however, am a jerk and will stoop, b-slap you, then get back up...so they are warranted, a lot of fun, and whatreyou? Chicken? Nyah!



Dr_Dubious wrote:

Obviously you have studied history and realize what happens when you start throwing people out on the streets. Yes, it is a pretty picture to corporate bottom lines - longer term you will have martial law. But what do I know...this has never happened before.

Yeah, our nation fell into utter chaos during the depression...crime everywhere, huh? :?

Throwing people out into the streets? That is what not awarding irresponsibility is called? Wherever you are, you made an appointment to be there!

Dr_Dubious wrote:

Bottom line: Your quality of life will SUCK wind and your taxes will go through the roof. That is what will happen. I would support that too...if I was a moron.

Ummmm...you are a moron, you should ensure both sides of your subjuntive statement match....also, you should take English 101 so you don't sound like flaming moron.

Why do you think taxes will go through the roof? To fund those bleeding-heart welfare programs you keep Chicken Littling about. :X

 

[Guest]

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I was just stating what you said, They can fend for themselves. - If attacking someone is repeating what they stated - I am guilty.

By the way - who asked you?

Crime rates fell more then one third between 1934 and 1935 as the nation emerged from the Great Depression.

Crime ratesdrop during good economic times and rise during bad ones.

With the onset of the Great Depression, it became evident that property tax revenues were rapidly declining as property owners lost their land.

Revenues from these taxes combined declined from a level of $2.4 billion in 1930 -- which represented about two-thirds of total tax revenues -- to less than $750 million by 1933.

The ill-fated reductions in 1929 not only lessened revenues but had noeffect in stemming the depression. Hmmm!!!!! 2001-2003 tax cuts???

Results - Income taxes increases were extraordinary. 3 brackets - highest bracket paid 65% fed tax. States also doubled their taxes. Highest earners were paying 94% tax rate. Unemployment was 25%.

Below sounds a lot like the housing market huh?

Factors that lead to the Great Depression

Speculations (people flipping houses and owning a dozen of them???) in the 1920s caused many people to by stocks with loaned money (home equity???) and they used these stocks as collateral for buying more stocks (homes). Broker's loans went from under $5 million in mid 1928 to $850 million in September of 1929 (consumer debt). The stock market boom was very unsteady, because it was based on borrowed money and false optimism. When investors lost confidence, the stock marcket collapsed, taking them along with it.
Short signed government economic policies (tax cuts, emergency fed rate???) were one of the factors that led to the Great Depression. Politicians believed that business was the key business in America. Thus, the government took no action against unwise investing (housing market???). The economy was not stable. National wealth was not spread evenly (how true???). Instead, most money was in the hands of a few families who saved or invested rather than spent their money on American goods (ahh change that to foreign goods - even worse). Thus, supply was greater than demand. Some people profited, but others did not. Prices went up and Americans could not afford anything. Unevenness of prosperity made recovery difficult.

History does repeat itself . The signals are very clear. Emergency fed rate has turned the housing market into a casino. Will be painful...not for me thou. I study history.

What is your high score? That is all that matters to you.

 

[Guest]

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Rolo wrote:

Why do you think taxes will go through the roof? To fund those bleeding-heart welfare programs you keep Chicken Littling about. :X

Public safety - public safety - police!!!

You start throwing people are the streets they are going to turn to crime to survive. What is that such a hard concept for you to grasp???

You are to dense for me. Good luck! I do not have the time to explain basic reality concepts to you. Good luck!

 

[Guest]

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The masses as a rule never ever learn. They are doomed to repeat their mistakes over and over again. Hence the saying "history repeats itself". They seem to love pain and misery and its something that will stay with the majority forever. The bursting of the Nasdaq bubble less than 5 years ago where trillions of dollars in market value were wiped out taught them nothing. They seem to think this is their second chance to make the killing of a lifetime. The sad part is just like the Nasdaq bubble; the masses are jumping in towards the end rather than at the beginning of the move.

It is the talk of the town now that real estate is the way to go now and the way to make a fortune. Everyone who knows nothing about investing has suddenly become a top-notch expert in this field and is busy dishing out advice. This is eerily similar to the last stages of the Nasdaq bubble. When markets enter the extended bubble phase it is really hard to predict when the end will come, however now that they are entering the hyperextend phase it virtually becomes impossible. All technical and fundamental tools cease to function, sanity is replaced with insanity and greed. What is certain is when this bubble bursts it going to be extremely painful and millions of individuals will find themselves among the ranks of the poor and destitute

Let them eat cake!

 

[Rolo]

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Dr_Dubious wrote:

I do not have the time to explain basic reality concepts to you.

Such idle threats...

 

[Guest]

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Rolo wrote:

Dr_Dubious wrote:

Good luck when crime rates go up double digits quarter after quarter.

Fine. Let the immoral kill each other. I live in a nice neighbourhood.

Such idle threats...

Yes, you are the center of the universe. Everything revolves around you.

We are humbled you even bless us with your wit,knowledge and well thought out advice of our future.

We shall bow to you and wait for your next calling.

To me you are a waste of time - your reference of history is about as far back as your last dump and that is what you dump on this board - crap. OMHO .

The masses as a rule never ever learn. They are doomed to repeat their mistakes over and over again. Hence the saying "history repeats itself".

Welcome to the masses...you deserve all your going to get buddy!

 

[Rolo]

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Dr_Dubious wrote:

To me you are a waste of time

See! I knew they were idle threats! <makes blah..blah..blahblahblahblah motion with hand>


Dr_Dubious wrote:

OK. I have been pounding the table about a major financial meltdown upcoming

I think you've been pounding your ***...you've been screaming about this meltdown for over a year now. TIMING is EVERYTHING.

 

[nnuut]

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Hee! Hee! Just love this stuff! You guys crack me up! Squabble it's good for the soul.:^

 

[Guest]

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In this corner standing 5'2" and weighting 420 lbs, 33 years old,been everywhere, makes money than Warren Buffet, and with a perfect 1004 and 0 record playing the market,from the beautiful state of Hawaii, Drrrrrrrr Dubiouuuuuuuussssssssss!!!!!!

And this corner standing 6'11" and weighing 120 lbs, 31 years old with himself serving as his own corner man, cut man, and ring side doctor, with a record of what else, 50 and 50, from the great state that brought you Coors Light and the Kobe Bryant fiasco, Roloooooooooo and ROLOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!

Okay gentleman, you know the rules. Pick 6 stocks or funds to put in your portfolios for the next 6 months. The winner gets to help Martha Stewart fulfill the rest of her home detention......................

Sorry, couldn't resist, I'll go back to my cardboard box now.....................

 

[Montana]

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Fair and Balanced. We get to hear both sides and make our own minds up. Works for me. Wish someone would look into their crystal ball and tell me how long the energy bubble is going to last. :#

 

[Guest]

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What is the reason for not passing this. If they really cared they would of passed it, IMHO:

By 59-40 tally, the Senate defeated a Democratic proposal to require that credit card statements show how long it would take the consumer to pay off his or her debt by making only the minimum monthly payment, and what the total interest charges would be.


Wonder why? Maybe they would stop charging stuff perhaps? Can not have that!

Does this seem rational?

 

[Mike]

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Whyshould a credit card companybe obligated to do the calculation for the person borrowing money from them? Maybe this is just me being "selfish" or "heartless" again, but I think it's the responsibility of the person borrowing the money to figure this outBEFORE borrowing the money. The interest rate is right there. Any idiot should be able to see that borrowing at 19% APR isn't the best idea if you aren't going to pay it off quickly.

Or how about this: maybe, just MAYBE, people shouldn't put more money on their credit cards than they can pay off in a month? I know, it's a novel idea and nobody else has even thought of it. *sigh*

BTW, the Great Depression had nothing to do with tax cuts. That is quite possibly the dumbest thing I've ever read. Tax cuts fuel demand via consumer spending. That, in turn, fuels the economy. The problem of the 1920s was that too many people borrowed too much money - and a lot of them were doing that and dumping the borrowed money into speculative investments. So, really, the problem was the spending of other people's money - and when thecrap hit the fan, people couldn'tpay their debts and the whole thing collapsed. This is why I don't like the concept of the margin account.

The Democratic proposal for exemptions was totally worthless. While it would've given greater protection to some of the currently indebted, it would have brought about some severe consequences: greater protection means less money for the creditors and lenders. That means they won't be likely to extend credit or loans in the future to people with marginal credit (read: lower-middle income earners). So, while you might be saving the house of someone who's going bankrupt today, you will be denying a house to a bunch of other people who no longer would be able to secure a loan to buy the thing in the first place.

Crafting policy based on emotion rather than logic is horribly inefficient and makes our society worse off as a whole. Don't fall prey to it!

 

[Show-me]

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Mike wrote:

Whyshould a credit card companybe obligated to do the calculation for the person borrowing money from them? Maybe this is just me being "selfish" or "heartless" again, but I think it's the responsibility of the person borrowing the money to figure this outBEFORE borrowing the money. The interest rate is right there. Any idiot should be able to see that borrowing at 19% APR isn't the best idea if you aren't going to pay it off quickly.

Devils advocate:

What about responsibility of the credit card companies? They allow people massive amounts of credit. No one twist their arms to let people have the credit. What responsibility should they have? Almost sound like the CC Companies need to improve their business practices by not letting every Tom, Dick, and Harry have credit at the drop of a hat. No one forced them to send massive mailings every day to get more customers. Granted the company will get their in the long run by charging higher interest to make up for the defaults. Again, what responsibility should be theirs?

As for you Mike, you are smart enough to know what to do and not do. The idiots will continue on being idiots and we will pay if the Credit Card Companies give them credit. Even if we make them indentured servants to the companies they don’t have any money to begin with so if they can’t see a light at the end of the tunnel why try. Again don’t give everyone credit. Be more strict and cautions when handing out credit. Sound like this legislation is a win win for the credit card companies. I can give credit to everyone and if someone defaults I can force them to pay up. Sound like a legalized LOAN SHARK!

Just another spin. Good luck everyone!