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greg wrote:
greg wrote:
The C and S funds were higher on December 1st 2004 than they are now. :X
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Dr_Dubious wrote:
I am guessing our European friends will fare no better.
Dr_Dubious wrote:
Nikkei down over 1% at midday
I am guessing our European friends will fare no better.
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greg wrote:
I am looking for a snatch and grab Thursday-Friday. However, do not want to get caught in an avalanche either. All depends on FOMC minutes.
Even after the big drop, for some reason I have no interest to take the chance.
greg wrote:
You MAY find after the U.S. has a big drop, the internationals sell off the next day.
I am looking for a snatch and grab Thursday-Friday. However, do not want to get caught in an avalanche either. All depends on FOMC minutes.
Even after the big drop, for some reason I have no interest to take the chance.
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tsptorture wrote:
Be so heavily weighted in Japan, UK, Germany and France we are leaving a lot of money on the table. The fund would be up greatly if we could of least have SOME Latin American exposure. That is why I hate the fund. Only the very small, small holdings are the ones providing the return to us.
tsptorture wrote:
Why doesn't the I fund have representation from Latin America??? They have some quickly growing economies down there. At least a small part of China would be nice.I agree with you Dr., for the first time I think, <) I fund will drop big time either Wed. or Thurs. Just my opinion of course. I HATE THE I FUND..........I'm sure the I fund being up today was another "correction" by TSP.
Be so heavily weighted in Japan, UK, Germany and France we are leaving a lot of money on the table. The fund would be up greatly if we could of least have SOME Latin American exposure. That is why I hate the fund. Only the very small, small holdings are the ones providing the return to us.
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tsptalk wrote:
That will also be the problem with private accounts. With no COLA index and if the market takes a giant hit. Like a one day drop of 30% that could hurt a lot of folks. The drop today is nothing. I remember back in 2001 when the NASDAQ fell250 pluspoints two days in a row. That is some real pain. How would you feel the NASDAQ was down 250 tomorrow and all you retirement was in one place?
tsptalk wrote:
Problemwith G fund is you do not keep with with inflation and the erosion of the U.S. dollar. So if you have $1,000 in there after a year the buying power on the $1,000 is closer to $888. If you put your money and there month after month, year after year. You may have saved $250K in 20 years. However, what is $250K going to buy you in 2025? That is the risk. What is the buying power of you money in the future??? 30 years ago if you had $200K you were a very well off person. Now if you have $200K you are doing all right. It is all realitive and that is the risk.That's why they made the G fund.
No risk = guaranteed small gain.
Somerisk = small to medium gain or loss.
Big risk = big gain or big loss.
The long term trend of the market is up and will get you a higher return than the G fund... in the long term. Guess which waythe wealthy invest?
That will also be the problem with private accounts. With no COLA index and if the market takes a giant hit. Like a one day drop of 30% that could hurt a lot of folks. The drop today is nothing. I remember back in 2001 when the NASDAQ fell250 pluspoints two days in a row. That is some real pain. How would you feel the NASDAQ was down 250 tomorrow and all you retirement was in one place?
SystemTrader
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Here's my take on "hating" the I Fund or any of the funds, for that matter.Many wise investors/traders have told us to never fall in love with a stock. This means if a stock starts tanking, you shouldsellit based onsome rational method (e.g., a stop loss) instead of holdingit because you like the company/feelit will make a big comeback/work it its industry, etc.
In the same way, you should allocate among the funds without any bias, IMHO. Whetherthe fundowns more stocks in France or Paraguay is irrelevent...the price trendof the fund is its best indicator and will tell you the most important info.Even if it seems counterintuitive...
My $0.02.
Here's my take on "hating" the I Fund or any of the funds, for that matter.Many wise investors/traders have told us to never fall in love with a stock. This means if a stock starts tanking, you shouldsellit based onsome rational method (e.g., a stop loss) instead of holdingit because you like the company/feelit will make a big comeback/work it its industry, etc.
In the same way, you should allocate among the funds without any bias, IMHO. Whetherthe fundowns more stocks in France or Paraguay is irrelevent...the price trendof the fund is its best indicator and will tell you the most important info.Even if it seems counterintuitive...
My $0.02.
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Bush Warns Europe on Ending China Embargo
Bush warned Congress might retaliate if Europe revokes the 15-year ban.
Question: Why are we telling everyone what to do now? How would you feel if you were on the other end and being lectured on what you can and can not do? It would get old, I would think. Especially if I am holding all your worthless dollars.
You will see more central banks dumping their U.S. debt holdings.
All Empires fall. Social security reform will not be all that important if we are invaded. Iran, Russia, Syria and China are lining up on one side - it appears Europe is about to switch sides. The cold war has nothing on that crew.
Bush Warns Europe on Ending China Embargo
Bush warned Congress might retaliate if Europe revokes the 15-year ban.
Question: Why are we telling everyone what to do now? How would you feel if you were on the other end and being lectured on what you can and can not do? It would get old, I would think. Especially if I am holding all your worthless dollars.
You will see more central banks dumping their U.S. debt holdings.
All Empires fall. Social security reform will not be all that important if we are invaded. Iran, Russia, Syria and China are lining up on one side - it appears Europe is about to switch sides. The cold war has nothing on that crew.
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SystemTrader wrote:
Interesting enough Japan and UK are the two major holders of U.S. debt. Scratch your parts, I scratch yours?
We all know Japan and UK are going no where fast. That is why I do not like the I fund. The performance will all ways be dragged down by those two dogs.
SystemTrader wrote:
It is not about the love. It is about it is NOT a international fund. No Latin American, no China, no Taiwan, etc, etc, To be an international fund it should have representation from all major markets and not heavily weighted in our two friends Japan and the UK.
Interesting enough Japan and UK are the two major holders of U.S. debt. Scratch your parts, I scratch yours?
We all know Japan and UK are going no where fast. That is why I do not like the I fund. The performance will all ways be dragged down by those two dogs.
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Spaf wrote:
Spaf wrote:
Did you read my post after his? It is not about love, it is about a fund that is advertised as an international index fund that isNOT an internationalindex fund. To be an index you would have representation from all major international markets. Not a select few and WHO picks the select few??? Oh Barclays's a UK company. Interesting UK is the second largest holding and UK is in no way shape orform the second largest international market. Interesting. Once again it is not hating it for the "stock" it is hating it for false appearances.SystemTrader wrote:
SystemTrader
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We could alsotalkabout the very high valuations of U.S. stocksthat comprise the S and C funds. Historically, U.S. stocks' P/E ratios (and other valuations) are way out of line. You've talked about problems of the G fund and almost everyone has slammed the F fund. But in the end you have to choose among these 5 funds. And none of them are perfect.
My point is that using some type ofobjective indicator(s) is the best way to evaluate the funds. I'm not here to defend Barclays, the U.K., Japan or what a true international fund should look like...
Peace,
John
Dr.,
We could alsotalkabout the very high valuations of U.S. stocksthat comprise the S and C funds. Historically, U.S. stocks' P/E ratios (and other valuations) are way out of line. You've talked about problems of the G fund and almost everyone has slammed the F fund. But in the end you have to choose among these 5 funds. And none of them are perfect.
My point is that using some type ofobjective indicator(s) is the best way to evaluate the funds. I'm not here to defend Barclays, the U.K., Japan or what a true international fund should look like...
Peace,
John
Spaf
Honorary Hall of Fame Member
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I understand what you are saying. However, this is TSP, our choices are quite limited in this program. I can sellect a ETF that is really running hot, or go into a hot sector fund. Maybe the I-fund is not the best, it's all we got for this program if you want to go international. TSP has very limited options. Vanguard Energy Vipers are up 15% this year, sorry not one of the TSP options.
ST was just saying don't fall in love with funds. They are just inventory instruments. What's hot today is cold tommorrow, just like clothes and cars.
Rgds Spaf
I understand what you are saying. However, this is TSP, our choices are quite limited in this program. I can sellect a ETF that is really running hot, or go into a hot sector fund. Maybe the I-fund is not the best, it's all we got for this program if you want to go international. TSP has very limited options. Vanguard Energy Vipers are up 15% this year, sorry not one of the TSP options.
ST was just saying don't fall in love with funds. They are just inventory instruments. What's hot today is cold tommorrow, just like clothes and cars.
Rgds
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Dave
TSP decided to name it the I fund or International fund, but it's never been "advertised" as anything but what it is, an ETF based on Barclay's EAFE. That's Europe, Asia, and Far East. I too would love it if South America were in there somewhere but based on my globe, it ain't gonna happen.
Dave
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On the TSP site it says:
I Fund: International Stock Index Investment Fund.
That is false advertisement to me.
Yes, deeper down you read it is only Europe, Asia and Far East, however where is Taiwan, China, Thailand, Indoensia, Malyasia, Philipines etc, etc - those economies are actually GROWING.
Sorry to cause a stir. This is a sore spot to me. The I fund would be doing SO MUCH better. You just do not understand the money we are leaving on the table with this "International Stock INDEX Investment Fund." It is crap.
On the TSP site it says:
I Fund: International Stock Index Investment Fund.
That is false advertisement to me.
Yes, deeper down you read it is only Europe, Asia and Far East, however where is Taiwan, China, Thailand, Indoensia, Malyasia, Philipines etc, etc - those economies are actually GROWING.
Sorry to cause a stir. This is a sore spot to me. The I fund would be doing SO MUCH better. You just do not understand the money we are leaving on the table with this "International Stock INDEX Investment Fund." It is crap.
Spaf
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Dr_Dubious wrote:
Option: Don't invest extras over 5% in TSP. Go to a broker (place) and invest them in more profitable stock. Be informed. Move the allocations to your best advantage. Manage your own funds.
Stay tuned with TSP Talk for controling the TSP funds to your best advantage until you can retire.
Don't go to Buy-and-hold investments, they hurt their investors in 2000. Go to a place where you can transfer funds to safe haven if needed. Be informed about the market, fundamentals, technical analysis, and other investment matters. It's your money!
And TSP didn't do this for how many million participants!
Sorry Dr_D. TSP hits a raw nerve at times. Rgds
Spaf
Dr_Dubious wrote:
Precisely!!!!!!!!!
Option: Don't invest extras over 5% in TSP. Go to a broker (place) and invest them in more profitable stock. Be informed. Move the allocations to your best advantage. Manage your own funds.
Stay tuned with TSP Talk for controling the TSP funds to your best advantage until you can retire.
Don't go to Buy-and-hold investments, they hurt their investors in 2000. Go to a place where you can transfer funds to safe haven if needed. Be informed about the market, fundamentals, technical analysis, and other investment matters. It's your money!
And TSP didn't do this for how many million participants!
Sorry Dr_D. TSP hits a raw nerve at times. Rgds
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Thank you for the reply, Spaf. However, it is best to max out your TSP to the fullest for the decrease in taxable income. The sore spot is the false and errouneous advertisement of a index product to us stupid sheep. It is to concentrated and it is not a EAFE representation. It is a shame.
Once again, I did not mean to vent. However, how can you invest in this when you know the heavily weighted countries suck, the fast growers are a small percentage and the true track burners are not even allowed to toe up?
Thank you for the reply, Spaf. However, it is best to max out your TSP to the fullest for the decrease in taxable income. The sore spot is the false and errouneous advertisement of a index product to us stupid sheep. It is to concentrated and it is not a EAFE representation. It is a shame.
Once again, I did not mean to vent. However, how can you invest in this when you know the heavily weighted countries suck, the fast growers are a small percentage and the true track burners are not even allowed to toe up?
Spaf
Honorary Hall of Fame Member
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Dr_Dubious wrote:
Decrease in taxable income?
Sorry Dr_D but the increases from taxable income can off set the other, if done right and informed. Thats the BIG "IF". Investments that pay 20% a year can be a blessing, if you know what to do. Thats the key point. Investing requires skill and knowledge!
If people are tasked to maintain investment accounts, they should have the skill and knowledge to manage their accounts.
Take a look at the TSP site, and see how money is invested! Damn shame!
Rgds :? Spaf
Dr_Dubious wrote:
Decrease in taxable income?
Sorry Dr_D but the increases from taxable income can off set the other, if done right and informed. Thats the BIG "IF". Investments that pay 20% a year can be a blessing, if you know what to do. Thats the key point. Investing requires skill and knowledge!
If people are tasked to maintain investment accounts, they should have the skill and knowledge to manage their accounts.
Take a look at the TSP site, and see how money is invested! Damn shame!
Rgds :? Spaf
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Your contribution into your TSP accounts lowers your adjusted taxable income amount for tax purposes. That is the best place to max out first. Does that make sense?
Your contribution into your TSP accounts lowers your adjusted taxable income amount for tax purposes. That is the best place to max out first. Does that make sense?
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Nikkei down 105
HNGSNG down 146
Australia down 35
Singapore down 20
Asia avg down about .96%
Euros down across the board so far, avg down about .65%.
U.S. futures:
500 - up .75
QQQQs - down 2
I can safely say, I HAVE NO IDEA what to do.
Stand pat, I guess. All eyes on 8:30am.
Nikkei down 105
HNGSNG down 146
Australia down 35
Singapore down 20
Asia avg down about .96%
Euros down across the board so far, avg down about .65%.
U.S. futures:
500 - up .75
QQQQs - down 2
I can safely say, I HAVE NO IDEA what to do.
Stand pat, I guess. All eyes on 8:30am.
Spaf
Honorary Hall of Fame Member
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Dr_Dubious wrote:
It seems to me that we are argueing a fine line!
Two people see a different image while millions suffer.
LETS CHANGE IT!
An ALLIANCE! We work for the better of government investors. Disagree ok! But the big picture is the better investment for TSP participants.
Dr_Dubious wrote:
Yes for tax purposes. And the max is ______? But no it does not make sense if you can off set it by better investments!
It seems to me that we are argueing a fine line!
Two people see a different image while millions suffer.
LETS CHANGE IT!
An ALLIANCE! We work for the better of government investors. Disagree ok! But the big picture is the better investment for TSP participants.
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