Market Trading - Considerations

Spaf

Honorary Hall of Fame Member
Market Trading - Considerations

Trading Considerations and Insights

We are considering that the TSP account is a retirement function, and not mad money. Is the competition to have a high TSP return a proper perspective, or should we be considering other factors? The home page at TSPTalk makes this statement "A well managed TSP account could make a major difference in your balance when you retire." So the question is what is well managed? Does well mean to chase after the board leaders? Can we be better managers?

We know that there is risk in investing in stocks, there are also rewards. Some strategies use a time horizon to measure growth versus preservation, such as the Life-cycle funds of TSP.

A person with retirement 28 years or more down the road can have a low emphasis on asset protection and a high emphasis on asset growth. This equates to an asset allocation of 15% safe funds (G, F), and 85% risk funds(C, S, I).

A person 18-27 from retirement has a mix of 15% safe and 85% risk. 8-17 years the risk lowers to 35% safe and 65% risk. 1-7 years equals 50/50.

A person with retirement less than a year down the road can have a high emphasis on asset protection and a low emphasis on asset growth. This equates to an asset allocation of 80% safe funds (G, F) and 20% risk funds (C, S, I).

Recooping losses. In math a 5% loss requires a 5.2% gain, a 10% loss requires a 11.1% gain, 25% a 33.3% gain and a 50% loss a 100% gain.

In funds verus portfolios, the portfolio should be balanced well enough or safe traded to prevent a loss of 2%, and no single fund should suffer a loss of over 5%.

To prevent these losses trailing alerts and trailing stops are used. Stops can be adjusted, but for mild index funds a 1% alert and a 2% trail can be used as starters.

There are two major concepts in trading conditions: Reading the fundamentals of the market and reading the charts, the basics of technical analysis. These equate to what is the economy doing and what is the market doing. The economy could be great but the market is in a correction. The US economy could be slowing but the international economy still steaming along.

Based upon the fundamentals and the analysis the trading conditions can be broken down into: Strong conditions, moderate conditions, and weak conditions. Allocations could be rated as 70-100% strong, 30-70% moderate, and 0-30% weak.

TSP allows the reallocation of assets through interfund transfers. A transfer will take from about 3 to 39 hours, depending on the time it was initiated from The 12:00 Eastern Time cutoff and the closing processes.

Lets run two examples.

#1. A person with 28 years to retirement has a $10,000 account and suffers a 5% loss. Thats $500 and 28 years to recover.
#2. A person in retirement has a $400.000 account and suffers a 5% loss. Thats a $20,000 flat loss.

So how do you trade to your advantage.

1. Understand that risks get higher as you near retirement, whether you buy and hold or trade.
2. Never let losses exceed 5%.
3. Try to catch losses at 1-2% by using trailing alerts and stops.
4. Consider the market trading conditions; the economics, charts, and market strength.
5. Select an allocation based on risk tolerance and fund(s) performance.
6. Time your buy-ins within a few hours or near the ET deadline.
7. Monitor your trades and immediately exit a bad trade.
 
Anyone who is in the envious position of being close to retirement has one great advantage over many others - they have the cash. And it takes cash to make more cash. Recognize the risk but don't be shy - you only loose in a downturn if you do an IFT to safety. Markets go down temporarily and then rebound to move higher. Watch all the members who are on the lilly pad this week - when the market heads higher, they'll have to pay more to catch up.
 
Spaf.......Interesting Market Trading - Considerations

The biggest factor with doing my IFT is having to do them the night before the noon deadline. I don't have the available time between 6:30am and Noon to do any other evaluations of an IFT. To time my buy-ins within a few hours of the ET deadline is really impossible because of my schedule and I don't have the available conditions for any possible way to do that other than if I wasn't working. lol

So, I have to be able to evaluate things from further out than most it seems here. I have to for the time being learn to make my decision for IFT the night before and be done with it. Oh, I could possibly phone them in, but I can't do anything else. Conditions are not right.

Any suggestions with those kinds of situations?

Thanks for your time and efforts with all this.
 
Spaf.......Interesting Market Trading - Considerations

The biggest factor with doing my IFT is having to do them the night before the noon deadline. I don't have the available time between 6:30am and Noon to do any other evaluations of an IFT. To time my buy-ins within a few hours of the ET deadline is really impossible because of my schedule and I don't have the available conditions for any possible way to do that other than if I wasn't working. lol

This puts you in a disadvantage. I've been told not to trade stock before the bell opens

So, I have to be able to evaluate things from further out than most it seems here. I have to for the time being learn to make my decision for IFT the night before and be done with it. Oh, I could possibly phone them in, but I can't do anything else. Conditions are not right. Any suggestions with those kinds of situations? Thanks for your time and efforts with all this.

You need to figure out something better. What about Keeping the phone number for TSP 877-968-3778 available. Watch CNBC, or a friend watch it. Maybe they could watch TSPTalk, and inform you by 11:00 ET what is going on. If it looks good let your IFT ride. But if it looks bad, you can call in a cancellation.

During the ice storm I lost my internet for about a week I did a market check using a TV and cell phone. We have some other members that lack access. Maybe we need a plan B.

In the mean time send a PM to mailmanusa and see how he gets around it.

Or, if you have a phone you could always gine me a call! I can send U my cell # via PM, if U want?

We can work something out.

Regards...........Spaf
 
Spaf........Interesting plan you have here. I just may want to take it up with you.

I have yet to use the phone for IFT. Don't know how it works. How do you get a confirmation by email with the phone?

I would have only about 10 minutes to call you and things would have to be to the point real quick with what is going on to make a decision to call an IFT in the day I talk to you.

I have a cell phone which is the only way I would be able to do this. I have no other means because of what my job dictates. No tv, computer or other. On the road during most of the day.

If you want to PM me and do this, we could have a chat and get it organized first though, before I get with it during work.

I am willing to give it a go to see how it works out though.

I appreciate your willingness, time and effort to come up with this and help me out.

I can see the advantages with doing all this within a couple of hours of the noon deadline.

Anyhoo, lets see what happens.

Thanks much for your insight with this matter.
 
Spaf:
Is there something analogous to trailing alerts/stops for us TSPers?
Scott

BigGuy,
I use paper trailing alert sand stops in the Market Talk thread: http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showpost.php?p=88564&postcount=10 The stops are 1% and 2%.
At 1424.55 [$SPX] the alert is -14 or 1423 the trail is -28 or 1409.
The problem is that if the decline is severe it can shoot clean through the stops. So, you need othe indicators to show overbought and over sold conditions.
Once I see OB conditions I go back to capital preservation, may 100%, maybe 50%, whatever to reduce the risk.
Spaf
 
Anyone who is in the envious position of being close to retirement has one great advantage over many others - they have the cash. And it takes cash to make more cash. Recognize the risk but don't be shy - you only loose in a downturn if you do an IFT to safety. Markets go down temporarily and then rebound to move higher. Watch all the members who are on the lilly pad this week - when the market heads higher, they'll have to pay more to catch up.

BUT, if the market falls those not on the Lilly Pad will have to pay twice as much to catch up!!! Think about it!:toung:
 
A loss of 5%, requires 5.2% to recover.
10% requires 11.1%
25% requires 33.3%
50% requires 100%
Selling quickly and avoiding large losses is a much better course to take.
Maximum loss any one stock: 5%
Maximum loss for a portfolio: 2%
 
In a raging bull market all corrections are eventually righted - and prices come back as fast as they go down. If you make no changes you are righted as soon as the market rebounds. If you are fortunate enough to be able to dollar cost average the bottoms with fresh cash you end up with more shares at cheaper pricing that also help with the rebound. If you cut and run on a loss you will undoubtedly never get right without further sacrifice. Be right and sit tight. Fear needs to be faced - know your orientation to the market and apply the opportunity when it's provided. What 2/27 did, if anything, is that it totally cleansed the system of any weak hands - the great majority are still looking for a retest and probably a repeat of 2000-2002.
 
There is probably a dozen or so ways to skin a catfish. Don't really matter how you skin it, just so long as you get to eat it!............:D
 
And there are many ways to catch a catfish - didn't we discuss noodling in Oklahoma as a viable way to fish with ones' hands. I mean those fish are large. Looks like the market takes it all back today - what happens if PPI is moderate and in line? It's time to DCA back in. Snort.
 
In a raging bull market all corrections are eventually righted - and prices come back as fast as they go down. If you make no changes you are righted as soon as the market rebounds. If you are fortunate enough to be able to dollar cost average the bottoms with fresh cash you end up with more shares at cheaper pricing that also help with the rebound. If you cut and run on a loss you will undoubtedly never get right without further sacrifice. Be right and sit tight. Fear needs to be faced - know your orientation to the market and apply the opportunity when it's provided. What 2/27 did, if anything, is that it totally cleansed the system of any weak hands - the great majority are still looking for a retest and probably a repeat of 2000-2002.

Picked up some 'S' and 'I' shares cheap yesterday because of my FERS allocations in those funds I was sitting in. As you know those 2 Funds took a rest and finished in the red the last 2 days.

Today?

Gravy :D

DCA is your friend.
 
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