Arizona Immigration law

Buster, my brother and his family were hit head on in broad daylight on a rural country road. The guy was uninsured, swiped 2 other vehicles before hitting my brother. Broad daylight. Brother was out of work for 2 months. the other guy didn't pay for that. $25K in medical bills my brother ate, the other guy's insurance didn't pay for that. The guy was a repeat offender, too. Brother's wife was injured, the 2 young children were badly shaken, not physically injured, they were in back seat. The'd have all died if hadn't been in the heavy old 70's boat brother inherited from grandmother. Engine compartment came in and smashed brother's knee.

My brother was incredibly fortunate, his employer kept him on as janitor when he couldn't bend down or bend over to do diesel mechanic work. for months. Brother=sole wage earner in his family, wife disabled, unable to drive or work, 2 young children. Yes, how effective were the DUI stops for that?
 
Wow, this was a busy thread the last few days! It took me a while to get caught up.

The guy mistakenly arrested and turned over to ICE was an unfortunate incident. If I'm not mistaken, the Arizona law hasn't even gone into effect yet, so I think someone may have jumped the gun.

Immigration Officers don't need probable cause to stop someone and determine alienage. The Arizona law will not require probable cause either. It will require reasonable suspicion, which is a lower standard. The Arizona law mirrors federal law, but authorizes state and local police to challenge citizenship on someone they have stopped for other reasons and reasonably suspect that they are not in the country legally.

For those that think the law will be overturned, because immigration is in the purview of the federal government, remember that the FBI investigates bank robberies. So does local and state law enforcement. Local cops don't ignore bank robberies as a federal issue, because there are state laws that make robbing banks a state crime in addition to a federal crime. The other thing to remember is that local law enforcement is already authorized to enforce immigration law under section 287g of the Immigration & Nationality Act, as amended. What the state did in passing the law, was prevent local city councils from setting up "Sanctuary Cities" within the state.

As you can imagine, I disagree with giving legal status to illegal immigrants. That is rewarding criminal conduct. You don't let a bank robber keep the money he stole from the bank, so why would you give legal status to someone who entered the country illegally, except for political expedience? We might not be able to deport everyone who is here illegally, but we sure haven't tried yet!

What I would do, though, is allow people to apply for temporary work visas, so that they can legally live and work in the United States, but have no path to citizenship. Every year or two, they have to return to their home countries and apply for new work visas. If anyone was convicted of ANY crime (felony or misdemeanor) while they are here, they are deported and are NEVER given another visa of any type to return. NO CHAIN MIGRATION EITHER! If you fall in love with a foreign born person and want to marry and immigrate that person here, that's great, but no other family members, except maybe for under age children of the potential spouse. No mom, dad, brother, sister, cousin, uncle, aunt, grandma, grandpa, etc.

There is much I would like to change with the current law. For example, I would change the law with respect to "knowingly" hiring illegal immigrants by taking out the word knowingly from the law. I have to pay my share of the tax burden. I am held responsible for my tax form, even if I have someone else prepare it for me. The same should be true for hiring illegal immigrants. Businesses should be held accountable for hiring illegal immigrants. Period. They should be required to use e-verify and/or hire an expert to determine citizenship of job applicants. If they hire someone here illegally, they should pay a fine and/or go to jail. THAT will almost guarantee no illegal immigrants are hired, especially if it is enforced!

Another problem with the removal system is overcrowding of our detention facilities. Immigration Judges take WAY too long to hear removal cases. Federal judges in the District courts in many districts refuse to issue orders of removal on people who commit aggravated felonies and are prosecuted federally, even though they have the authority to do so under the law. As a result, we fill up bed space with people that could have been ordered removed as part of their federal criminal sentence.

I could go on, but it's time for some Jack Daniels!:D Later!
 
Buster, my brother and his family were hit head on in broad daylight on a rural country road. The guy was uninsured, swiped 2 other vehicles before hitting my brother. Broad daylight. Brother was out of work for 2 months. the other guy didn't pay for that. $25K in medical bills my brother ate, the other guy's insurance didn't pay for that. The guy was a repeat offender, too. Brother's wife was injured, the 2 young children were badly shaken, not physically injured, they were in back seat. The'd have all died if hadn't been in the heavy old 70's boat brother inherited from grandmother. Engine compartment came in and smashed brother's knee.

My brother was incredibly fortunate, his employer kept him on as janitor when he couldn't bend down or bend over to do diesel mechanic work. for months. Brother=sole wage earner in his family, wife disabled, unable to drive or work, 2 young children. Yes, how effective were the DUI stops for that?
I'm very sorry for your brother's circumstances..I'm not sure I understand entirely what you are trying to say..or is it to just take a stand in argument?..If the latter is the case I won't reply to anymore irrational emotion driven contrary discussion on the subject....

Was this guy drunk also in broad daylight?..If so, it is a pity that he was still driving after repeat offenses as you say (what repeat offenses though, you didn't say?) had they been DUI's, then I blame the liberal bleeding heart system for letting him loose..but aside from that, Statistically it is proven that MOST DUIs and Drunk driving occurs late at night after the bars close..so to be logistically responsible and prudent, Police know NIGHT TIME is the best time to catch the majority of these maggots (ever hear the expression from a cop?.."the only people on the road after midnight are Cops and Drunks")..But as you certainly will admit, there is always exceptions and we, or the Law can't cover them all...Like getting hit by lightening..we try to avoid it, but sometimes it just catches the unlucky few outside in the open in broad daylight...nothing anyone can do about bad luck unfortunately...So to keep most of these drunkin animals off the roads, random sobriety roadblock check points are needed IMO, even if they only catch one...that's one less to hurt anyone else's family such as yours.

Sincerely, I hope the best for your brother and his family and that the worst is behind them..





NOTE TO LADY:..sorry for the off topic about DUI roadblocks on this thread...But Since Off topic discussions are now being allowed in other threads right now unchecked, I figured it'd be alright here too.
 
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Buster, the guy WAS drunk, broad daylight. And yes, was a repeater on DUIs. It took brother and family many months to recover-physically, emotionally, financially. It was a few years ago, I drove all the way down to ABQ to help out for a week, take brother to the neurosurgeon appt (3o miles away) since SIL doesn't drive and brother couldn't drive himself anywhere at the time.

My point is unreasonable searches. Drunks wont hurt anyone but themselves or another drunk, if its only drunks out that time of night, right? but if there are other people out that time of night for their own personal reasons, minding their p's and q's, and not driving erratically, then roadblocks impacting them are in effect a presumption of guilt and an unreasonable search. JMO. I guess I'm libertarian that way. But so are several western states I've lived in.
 
Buster, the guy WAS drunk, broad daylight. And yes, was a repeater on DUIs. It took brother and family many months to recover-physically, emotionally, financially. It was a few years ago, I drove all the way down to ABQ to help out for a week, take brother to the neurosurgeon appt (3o miles away) since SIL doesn't drive and brother couldn't drive himself anywhere at the time.

My point is unreasonable searches. Drunks wont hurt anyone but themselves or another drunk, if its only drunks out that time of night, right? but if there are other people out that time of night for their own personal reasons, minding their p's and q's, and not driving erratically, then roadblocks impacting them are in effect a presumption of guilt and an unreasonable search. JMO. I guess I'm libertarian that way. But so are several western states I've lived in.
I understand everything you said..I too will admit; I usually come home late at night from a date and get stopped at one of these Roadblocks..I grumble under my breath of course and call the cops a pain..But when they come to my window, get a sniff and then after a few polite and grateful "Yes sirs", I'm on my way again..no harm no foul...and I feel the road is safer...at least for the moment....Lastly I'll repeat what a cop told me while arresting me for a DUI.."Most likely, ONLY COPS and Drunks on the road at this time of night"...Yes, those sober people that are out there too coming home from dates, night-shift at work or going to work, etc...The cop can't tell who's who until they are inspected..I don't think they are unreasonable inspections....So being reasonably patient isn't asking a lot for the sake of safer roads and for the duty of the officers.
 
Well, we'll just have to disagree on constitutionality. DUI Roadblocks haven't gone to the supreme court yet but at least one state has backed down.

Back to the main topic. Here's something I thought would show up in some fashion sooner or later regarding the new law....although the viewpoint about guest worker program hurting the U.S. surprised me a little.

You Don't Speak for Me! is a group of concerned Americans of Hispanic/Latino heritage, some first or second generation, others recent legal immigrants, who believe illegal immigration harms America and a guest worker amnesty will do the same.
http://www.dontspeakforme.org/principles.html
 
Rachel Maddow has an interesting twist on the Arizona law-

She says it was written by...well, you decide:



And here is another video about Senator Russell Pearce:
Caution- disturbing video:




I don't know what to think - I am just posting it because it's out there in cyberspace.


 
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...NOTE TO LADY:..sorry for the off topic about DUI roadblocks on this thread...But Since Off topic discussions are now being allowed in other threads right now unchecked, I figured it'd be alright here too.
Hey, no worries there from me. First of all, you'll notice I chimed right in when this AZ law thread hit the bend in the road that went to "is it unreasonable?" http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showpost.php?p=268360&postcount=75 I think that the DUI roadblock thread drift is appropriate to the main subject because detainment is at the heart of what we're talking about here.

And secondly, I'm not the Thread Subject Police. :toung: There are set rules on this MB (http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showpost.php?p=56257&postcount=1) And as long as people are treating each other with respect and are not posting material that is grossly inappropriate, then I'm just another MB member enjoying where the conversation takes us and chiming in when I have something to say. :) Which is often.:laugh:
 
There is nothing wrong with immigration. As everyone is talking about it is the illegal immigrants that cost this country huge dollars. Maybe our politicians need to enforce some easy changes.

Get ride of "If you speak English press one" and "If you speak Spanish press two". All information should be in English only. If you are not willing to learn how to speak, read or write the language get out. Most everybody that immigrated here in the 1800's and 1900's made the effort.

Get rid of the law that allows non American women to give birth here and their child immediately becomes an American citizen.

Just my opinion.

Force field up and flame retardant suit on. :nuts:
 
I do believe that up to 2007 we from the USA could travel to Mexico, the Caribbean etc. without a passport. The law was changed, now a passport is required if you leave the USA and I suppose it's the same requirement coming into the states? This tells me that foreigners entering must have a passport or equivalent NOW, and it must be checked when entering the USA. Isn't that the law, if the law is broken what are the authorities SUPPOSED/REQUIRED to do?:nuts:

What is the Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative?

By Suzanne Barbezat, About.com Guide


See More About:
Question: What is the Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative?
Answer: The WHTI, or Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative, is part of the US government's response to 9/11. The goal of the WHTI is to strengthen border security and facilitate entry for US citizens and legitimate international visitors to the United States.
For many years, US and Canadian citizens were not required to present a passport to enter the United States. With the implementation of the Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative, all citizens of the United States, Canada, Mexico, and Bermuda will be required to present a passport or other accepted document that establishes the bearer's identity and nationality in order to enter or depart the United States from within the Western Hemisphere.
The Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative is being rolled out in phases.

Timeline for implementation of WHTI
January 23, 2007
All persons, including US citizens, traveling by air between the United States and Canada, Mexico, the Caribbean and Bermuda are required to present a valid passport to enter (or re-enter) the United States.

January 31, 2008
US Customs and Border Protection (CBP) ended the practice of accepting oral declarations of citizenship and identity alone at land and sea ports of entry.

June 1, 2009
Passport or other WHTI-compliant document (such as a passport card or trusted traveler card) is required for entry into the United States, including travel by land and sea. [more]
http://gomexico.about.com/od/entryrequirements/f/whti.htm
 
James48843 article: "Because I’m not going back to Arizona as long as it remains a police state, which is what the appalling anti-immigrant bill that Gov. Jan Brewer signed into law last week has turned it into."

Oh, the exaggeration. Why do supposedly educated people get influenced by an author such as this? Say, I heard a new term yesterday to replace "illegal immigrants" and "undocumented immigrants" and "future amnesty applicants". The new term is "unregistered Democrats". :)

nnuut, do you have a graphic for the tipping point? :)
 
And here is another video about Senator Russell Pearce:
Caution- disturbing video:​

I don't know what to think - I am just posting it because it's out there in cyberspace.
These people are a danger to our country, and are following in the footsteps of you know who.
Socialists!! View attachment 9134
 
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...
Get ride of "If you speak English press one" and "If you speak Spanish press two". All information should be in English only. If you are not willing to learn how to speak, read or write the language get out. Most everybody that immigrated here in the 1800's and 1900's made the effort.

...
Except in New Mexico, where it is written into the State's Constitution that it is a bilingual state and things will be done in both Spanish and English.

They wanted to honor their heritage. Because the USA took that land as part of the war settlement. You know, "we have the right to claim this land from the savages because God is on our side" stuff.
 
Oh, the exaggeration. Why do supposedly educated people get influenced by an author such as this? Say, I heard a new term yesterday to replace "illegal immigrants" and "undocumented immigrants" and "future amnesty applicants". The new term is "unregistered Democrats". :)

nnuut, do you have a graphic for the tipping point? :)
YES!!:laugh:
View attachment 9135
 
...
Get ride of "If you speak English press one" and "If you speak Spanish press two".
Button One will become Button Two and Button Two will become Button One. Then Button Two can be eliminated. Really. Which states will be like Quebec...resentful about the subjugation of their language?

Get rid of the law that allows non American women to give birth here and their child immediately becomes an American citizen.
The "citizenship birthright" is here to stay. We can't even save Button One/Two.

Just my opinion.
Moi aussi.

:nuts:
Noted my comments in blue.
 
...Because the USA took that land as part of the war settlement. You know, "we have the right to claim this land from the savages because God is on our side" stuff.

There you go with that reparations stuff. You know our civil war military leaders needed hands on experience. And, isn't it bad enough that our big corporations have already had to suffer from nationalization in latin america, and the resulting impact on our rich tycoons? They're still trying to regain their total control there as well as here. Besides, wasn't France in the action somewhere?:D How many generations are required to pay for perceived wrongs? Two? Three? Four? Five? Six? Seven? Eight? Nine?
 
reported that protesters in AZ have smeared swasktiskas on Capitol with refried beans. the Bean Party? Or howabout, Beanbaggers?
 
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