Great, now the US Automakers want a Bailout

Re: rather give it to GM than non-paying home loaners

amoeba said:
Used to think this was a bad idea, until I heard some worse ones, like the $700B bailout of banks, and the $300B bailout of anyone who doesn't make home payments.
.....

compared to the loan defaulters, I'd give it to GM and have them build whatever energy-efficient car they can come up with, buy a whole bunch of cars, and hand them out for free. Whatever $700B can buy, just not to banks who make bad loans, or people who don't pay them.
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Oh, you mean when they had the chance to take all the profits from gas guzzling SUVs and didn't return the favor by putting energy efficient hybrids or straight electrical cars on the market?

Please, Amoeba, I want to slam the world with all this dishonesty as well, but don't ever doubt for a second that this is a capitalistic model unraveling before our eyes. Any time the government intervenes with business, gets us one step closer to being anything else.

CAPITALISM as a whole is doomed to failure when left unchecked. Balancing laws with running a business will always be an art, not a science.
 
rather give it to GM than non-paying home loaners

Used to think this was a bad idea, until I heard some worse ones, like the $700B bailout of banks, and the $300B bailout of anyone who doesn't make home payments.

Gee, my car is worth half what I paid for it (in cash); wanna give me $9,000 back?

Oh, what's that? you want the taxpayers to pay for the decrease in your home value? What makes it your home? Oh, that's right - you didn't buy the house, you just borrowed money - and used it to buy the house.

Oh, but the rate adjusted and you can't pay it now? well then, you might have looked up the word "adjustable".

My sympathy for these low lifes home loan defaulters is zero. There are alot of people who save up down payments for a decade or more to buy real estate; their houses declined in value too. And guess what? who is offering to give them money. They are paying their loans.

compared to the loan defaulters, I'd give it to GM and have them build whatever energy-efficient car they can come up with, buy a whole bunch of cars, and hand them out for free. Whatever $700B can buy, just not to banks who make bad loans, or people who don't pay them.
 
hessian said:
From link above...

"Cerberus buys Chrysler after Daimler bought it earlier, and now has its hand out, and that's not even a publicly-traded company. Its a private hedge fund, basically, which appears to have made a bad bet and now wants the government to back it.

Oh, and by the way, Chrysler already got its bailout. It was stuck in the housing bill. You didn't know that? Well its in there - go read it. That's right, a private company got bailed out at your expense - in the housing bill - to make cars!)

"Too big to fail"? Gee, that net keeps getting wider and wider doesn't it?..."
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It is the new American way, even on individual basis people that don't need the money have their hands out. They figure that is the system in place why not use it. I personally know people that are very wealth, not just well off, but very wealthy collecting a Social Security check. Yes, they paid into the system but the system was not originally created for those folks. It was created for the folk that don't have a dime or got screwed by the companies like Enron. And, IMO the entire Enron and Aurthur Anderson board member and Executive should all be in jail. Make examples out of them.
 
hessian said:
Where are our lawmakers, polititians, government regulators - or is the REAL question:
Whose pockets do they ALL have their hands in?... Automakers have known for decades, but...
http://market-ticker.denninger.net/archives/548-Automakers-Gimme-That-Money-TOO!!!!!!.html :notrust::mad:
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From link above...

"Cerberus buys Chrysler after Daimler bought it earlier, and now has its hand out, and that's not even a publicly-traded company. Its a private hedge fund, basically, which appears to have made a bad bet and now wants the government to back it.

Oh, and by the way, Chrysler already got its bailout. It was stuck in the housing bill. You didn't know that? Well its in there - go read it. That's right, a private company got bailed out at your expense - in the housing bill - to make cars!)

"Too big to fail"? Gee, that net keeps getting wider and wider doesn't it?..."
 
yep...thats what should be done with financials as well. Look at Lehman...let the strong survive and eat the weak. gobble gobble gobble.
 
Nah....let's give them a Fannie/Freddie loan with options. 8% interest plus 2% of the profits over 15 years. CEO's salaries to be limited to SES max.
 
rokid said:
Oops, forget the "buy" opportunity. GM has a NEGATIVE book value (-$100 per share)! You've got to be kidding! Tell me again, why did Rick Wagoner make $15.7M last year? Maybe they should try Countrywide for a no income, factory equity loan.:mad:

Maybe, I should move some money out of the C Fund.:laugh:
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Great idea! Countrywide...er Country of A, BA Country? surely has a nice 22% ARM breaker credit card they can use (read the fine print).
 
Oops, forget the "buy" opportunity. GM has a NEGATIVE book value (-$100 per share)! You've got to be kidding! Tell me again, why did Rick Wagoner make $15.7M last year? Maybe they should try Countrywide for a no income, factory equity loan.:mad:

Maybe, I should move some money out of the C Fund.:laugh:
 
rokid said:
GM's capitalization is only $5.91B. Why loan them money? Buy them. Nationalize them. Government employees couldn't possibly do a worse job of running GM. Plus, the CEO would make less than $200K a year. Not the $15.7M Rick Wagoner made in 2007.:mad: -----Jim

P.S. Kill Chrysler. I bought an 1994 Dodge Intrepid. I'll NEVER buy another Chrysler product.
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Not exactly a bad idea, but it begins to look more like a communist state.:eek::ban:
 
That's one thing you really really don't want, trust me. Bureaucrats don't know a thing about running a car company. Might as well ask Microsoft to run it because they make lots of money and they captured the U.S. software market.:worried:

I'm with you on Chrysler, and still can't find anyone who can fix my 1994 Ford Crown Vic after the repair guy at the dealer broke it - it also has 6 recalls. That leaves GM and their cars are simply too big, it's just me in the car now.
 
GM's capitalization is only $5.91B. Why loan them money? Buy them. Nationalize them. Government employees couldn't possibly do a worse job of running GM. Plus, the CEO would make less than $200K a year. Not the $15.7M Rick Wagoner made in 2007.:mad: -----Jim

P.S. Kill Chrysler. I bought an 1994 Dodge Intrepid. I'll NEVER buy another Chrysler product.
 
More from http://www.nlcnet.org/article.php?id=562


"Temporary workers—who make up one-third of Toyota’s assembly line workers—are paid a base page of $11.05 an hour, which rises to $12.13 when bonuses are included. Temps earn just 60 percent of what full-time workers earn. When benefits are added, the wage disparity is even greater. (For example, full-time workers receive child benefits of $18.63 a month for one child, $33.52 for up to three children, and $52.67 for four or more children. Also, at Toyota’s cafeteria, full-time workers eat for $3.96 per meal, while temporary and subcontract workers have to pay around $5.94.)​
Temps Earn $12.13 an Hour

Temporary workers earn a base wage of 200,000 Yen a month with an average of another 18,583.33 Yen in bonuses.​
  • $12.13 an hour
    ​
  • $485.28 a week
    ​
  • $2,102.89 a month
    ​
  • $25, 234.63 a year​
Temps earn $8.63 (41 percent) less than full-time workers. For every temp Toyota hires, in comparison with full-time workers, the company saves $17,381.73 a year in wages, not including the significantly lower benefits paid to temporary workers. By hiring 10,000 low-paid temps to work on its assembly lines, Toyota is able to cut its direct labor costs by $174 million a year."​
 
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